Convince me... Minnesota Winter + M3

[Sherpa]

Hey guys. The time is soon approaching to get a new car as the lease on my 335xi and E63 are coming to an end. I'm looking for a single car to replace both.

I'm about 90% dead-set on a E90 M3. The 10% uncertainty comes due to winter conditions here in Minnesota. Some years are worse than others, but when it's bad, the conditions can cause hundreds of accidents in the metro area every few hours. I have been driving Audi's and BMW's in the winter (the xDrive is better than Quattro IMO) and therefor my hesitation comes when thinking of removing my AWD security blanket for the 10% of the days out of the year where driving can be dangerous due to snow/ice. One of my favorite activities is driving in the snow;I left for work 2.5 hours earlier this morning just to have some fun in the fresh snow before commuters clogged the roads.

I have friends that drive their GT3's (people even ice race them) and other high performance RWD cars up here year round and seem to have minimal issues. I'm not exactly keen on getting another 335xi because I would end up modifying it and I just want a car that left the factory with the power/performance that I want... which is why the E90 M3 is top on my list.

Who all out here tackles the winter with their M3? What are your experiences? Would you buy the same car again after your experiences?

Thanks!

[brava09]

Check this thread

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=337613


apparently M3 is doing pretty good in snow.

[sparkyg]

E90 M3 no prob in snow, northern Alberta here, Minnesota no problem

It was friggin -40F last month, she just keeps on running.

Easy to drive and the traction control does what it is supposed to do

GL

[Georgeair]

For a few thousand, you can get a dedicated winter beater on the side. I'm not talking about another fancy 335xi, I'm talking an old Jeep Wagoneer, a mid-90's Suburban 4x4, anything that is AWD/4WD.

Personally, if I moved back to a serious snow area I'd go that route for my own piece of mind on the nasty days, and rely on the huge advancements in winter tires for the everyday "normal weather" commutes.

Good luck!

[Sherpa]

Thanks to the link to the above thread. I was reading that one earlier this morning.

Sparkyg, you're right: if an M3 can be driven in Alberta, Minnesota is no problem

[Radiation Joe]

Originally Posted by Sherpa

Thanks to the link to the above thread. I was reading that one earlier this morning.

Sparkyg, you're right: if an M3 can be driven in Alberta, Minnesota is no problem

Keep one thing in mind. The M cars use very thick oil (10W-60). If you leave the car outside for an extended period, the engine might not like it very much when you start. I spent two winters between Minneapolis and St Cloud. My e46 made terrible noises if I left it outside for too long. My e90 has never been inside a garage, and the engine has never made a peep down to temperatures in the teens. But I haven't had it in the really cold temps of MN.

Regarding snow use, however, my e90 has been a champ. It spent it's first winter west of Syracuse, New York with no garage. With good winter tires (Michelin PA2 or PA3) it'll go through anything as long as you have ground clearance. The limited slip is very handy when DSC stops helping. In very slippery conditions I turn off DSC and let the rear tires spin like crazy to get up hills. This won't work in a standard 3 series without LSD.

Bottom line is I would not hesitate to drive my e90 M3 around Minnesota as a daily driver.

[Damage Inc]

I drive my M3 year round, I have an extra set of M5 replica's with good snow tires. You can get around fine, just take it easy when conditions get bad. Not even AWD gurantees no issues dont forget.

[Sherpa]

Originally Posted by Radiation Joe

Keep one thing in mind. The M cars use very thick oil (10W-60). If you leave the car outside for an extended period, the engine might not like it very much when you start. I spent two winters between Minneapolis and St Cloud. My e46 made terrible noises if I left it outside for too long. My e90 has never been inside a garage, and the engine has never made a peep down to temperatures in the teens. But I haven't had it in the really cold temps of MN.

Regarding snow use, however, my e90 has been a champ. It spent it's first winter west of Syracuse, New York with no garage. With good winter tires (Michelin PA2 or PA3) it'll go through anything as long as you have ground clearance. The limited slip is very handy when DSC stops helping. In very slippery conditions I turn off DSC and let the rear tires spin like crazy to get up hills. This won't work in a standard 3 series without LSD.

Bottom line is I would not hesitate to drive my e90 M3 around Minnesota as a daily driver.

Thanks for the input! I have a heated garage so I'm ok on the oil issues; the car may sit outside for 12 hours during work, but no more than that.

MojorisinM3, you're right that AWD isn't a guarantee against bad weather conditions... but it does allow you to have a bit more fun!

[valeram]

A set of winter wheels/tires will be good enough to survive the winter. The only problem of course is the ground clearance. My M3 is my everyday car and I have a set of winter wheels/tires for this purpose. But OH get less snow than MN.

[White Shark]

If I were you , I would consider S4 (B8)...

[AMOCHOSTO]

M3 drives fine in both slush and snow with the proper tires. Remember, AWD only helps you accelerate, it doesn't help you brake or turn accidents usually happen when you can't brake fast enough or loose it in a turn, not when you can't accelerate fast enough.

[Sherpa]

Originally Posted by White Shark

If I were you , I would consider S4 (B8)...

Not a fan of Audi's anymore, but have yet to drive the new S4.

[Periokid]

With a good set of winter tires, you should be fine. I have had a few powerful, rear drive cars and with winter rubber they all were great.

[brava09]

Audi sucks in the snow

[needspeed]

We own both a 328i xDrive and an M3 that are our DDs hers and mine and live in Minnesota. The M3 with dedicated snows works as well as the 328 on M+S all seasons. No problem at all for the M3, we are comfortable taking either out no matter the weather. Also the M3 is a DD, not a car to be kept in the garage for special days as far as I am concerned.........Steve

[signes]

I am an E90 owner and use mine every day here in Colorado. Just had more snow and -15F overnight and no issues. I run aggressive snows on my car, much more aggressive than the PA3 or Wintersport M3s, and feel very comfortable driving in basically any conditions. I've been in the car in the mountains in a snow storm and it did great. Don't buy a different car just for 5-10% of the year because people perceive RWD to be not capable in the snow.

As Joe says above, the LSD on this car is really helpful, as is the great weight distribution and handling. I went out last night after work just to go have some fun - no bigger smile on my face than powersliding around parking lots and empty streets in the snow.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Sherpa

Would you buy the same car again after your experiences?

I would drive any RWD car in the snow as long as it has the proper tires. If I were rich I'd drive my garage full of exotics all winter long simply because I could. Of course I'd have plenty of other vehicles too, sure. But RWD in winter is king!

[ideliver]

Originally Posted by valeram

A set of winter wheels/tires will be good enough to survive the winter. The only problem of course is the ground clearance. My M3 is my everyday car and I have a set of winter wheels/tires for this purpose. But OH get less snow than MN.

Those living in C-bus or Cinci...this is true...but some of us live in the "snow belt" where it averages over 100" of snow/yr (with 40" to date this season)

The M will be fine in the snow...I would suggest the Blizzak LM-60's (new this season) for your needs...the LM-22's and have never let me down

[Radiation Joe]

Originally Posted by ideliver

Those living in C-bus or Cinci...this is true...but some of us live in the "snow belt" where it averages over 100" of snow/yr (with 40" to date this season)

The M will be fine in the snow...I would suggest the Blizzak LM-60's (new this season) for your needs...the LM-22's and have never let me down

I was living in Oswego, NY last winter. The only place in the continental US that gets more snow is the upper peninsula of Michigan. I stuck with the PA2s as apposed to a pure snow tire and still got around fine with no other vehicle. Keep in mind I drove 3k miles per month that winter.

As a Minnesotan(?) I think you know a little bit about winter tires. For others on this list, although Minneapolis can get some nasty storms, the majority of the winter is just really cold and dry. So, well mannered winter tires are a good choice. Hence my recommendation of the Michelin PA2/PA3.

Forgot to add that you have the best Audi dealer in the country at Carousel. That's enough to get me to consider an S4. But I think I'd still stick with the e90 M3 (from Sears).

[RichB]

Just picked up my e90 M3 on Monday and immediately installed the Blizzak LM-60 (235/35-19 and 265/35-19) on a second set of OEM 19". Last night we got a few inches of snow. I took it out last night to "test" the snow performance. Car was a blast to drive. I was very pleased given the wide 19" in the rear. I thought about buying a 4WD beater for winter, but decided that snow driving is yet another fun experience in the M. It was great to practice drifting in a safe way, plus it is easier on the tires than doing it on pavement.

The other fun part is the reaction you get when people see a M3 in the snow. The RWD perception of bad in snow causes people to do a double look.

I feel more comfortable with my snow tire equipped M3 than my wife's FWD.

I had 328xi loaner last year (all-season tires)and it was also a lot of fun to drive in the snow. I cannot say that it was any better than the M with snows.

[Sherpa]

You guys have convinced me Now it's just a matter of finding the right one.

I typically run Nokian snow tires. Currently I have Hakkapeliitta RSI's on the 335xi and definitely enjoy them.

It's nice to hear from other M3 owners take pride in enjoying the 4 seasons!

[mwlmd]

Originally Posted by Sherpa

You guys have convinced me Now it's just a matter of finding the right one.

I typically run Nokian snow tires. Currently I have Hakkapeliitta RSI's on the 335xi and definitely enjoy them.

It's nice to hear from other M3 owners take pride in enjoying the 4 seasons!

I am running 245/40/18 square setup of Nokian WRG2 on V710s. Been very happy with them.