Need Advice - Thinking of buying an E90 M3 as my next car :-/

[pimp4cheddar]

So...my lease is up on my M235i. I love the car...but we're thinking of having kid(s) within the next year so I need a 4 door. I had an E92 335i 6spd and I miss that chassis bad and after going to the F20 with electric steering...I miss the E90 feel.

I don't have many options but I wanted to keep my payment pretty low (under $500 a month) and I couldn't figure out what would be an engaging car for under $500 (finance or lease). I was thinking of maybe a new 5 Series 530i as a lease but I think I want to own my next car (and the 530i doesn't seem like something that'll put a huge smile on my face every day).


So I'm stuck...am I making a huge mistake? Is buying a used car like this just asking for painful repairs? The car will be out of warranty...so I'll be on my own. I'd be looking for a 2011.5 - 2013 to avoid RB repairs and most small kinks.


Thoughts? Do any owners have a warranty that's worth considering?

Should I be looking at other cars? I considered a used Tesla S (I know I know...but I can get a 2-3 year old one for around $35k and I'd save on gas).

[nrubenstein]

Originally Posted by pimp4cheddar

So...my lease is up on my M235i. I love the car...but we're thinking of having kid(s) within the next year so I need a 4 door. I had an E92 335i 6spd and I miss that chassis bad and after going to the F20 with electric steering...I miss the E90 feel.

I don't have many options but I wanted to keep my payment pretty low (under $500 a month) and I couldn't figure out what would be an engaging car for under $500 (finance or lease). I was thinking of maybe a new 5 Series 530i as a lease but I think I want to own my next car (and the 530i doesn't seem like something that'll put a huge smile on my face every day).


So I'm stuck...am I making a huge mistake? Is buying a used car like this just asking for painful repairs? The car will be out of warranty...so I'll be on my own. I'd be looking for a 2011.5 - 2013 to avoid RB repairs and most small kinks.


Thoughts? Do any owners have a warranty that's worth considering?

Should I be looking at other cars? I considered a used Tesla S (I know I know...but I can get a 2-3 year old one for around $35k and I'd save on gas).

You are not avoiding any bearing issues by purchasing a late model M3 with the revised bearings.

[pimp4cheddar]

I'd be looking for something under 40k miles FYI. Essentially a garage queen.

Options wouldn't matter to me... Don't care about In/Ex color (just no grey interior). 6spd or DCT is fine. ZCP or not is fine.

[EnVe46]

I love my E90, it's perfect for my needs. If you can find one well sorted there's only a few issues like bearings and throttle actuators that will hurt to pay for. Flip side of that is if you buy one cheap and get it up to date like I did with mine it can get costly but that's to be expected for a M3.

[Blindside_137]

Well if you want E90 M3 you are limited to 2008-2011.

As far as RB's go, it's really hit or miss and I wouldn't say the 2011-2013's are safe. But it seems like most would advise new owners to go ahead and do preventive maintenance and just swap the bearings out so you have peace of mind. Other than that and throttle actuators the E9x M3 is fairly reliable as far as M cars are concerned.

With regard to cars in general, if you are worried about maintenance of the M3 and miss the E9x why not another 335i or even a 328i in E90 form. Those run low 20k range for 50k miles. Payments would be in the 300 a month range. They are great cars and plenty of fun to drive.

[nrubenstein]

Originally Posted by pimp4cheddar

I'd be looking for something under 40k miles FYI. Essentially a garage queen.

Options wouldn't matter to me... Don't care about In/Ex color (just no grey interior). 6spd or DCT is fine. ZCP or not is fine.

Low mileage helps a little, but is not a guarantee.

Here's what 13.9k rod bearings looked like out of a 2013 motor I just acquired:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1449183

(Because my 2011.75 sedan ate a main bearing at 68k.)

[Foggins]

Probably blasphemous on this forum, but what about a new S3/Golf R or a used S4?

[GRUESOM3]

If it's your only car I wouldn't do a e90 m3 especially with kids on way.

I have a e90 6mt rwd 328i and it's a perfect daily and kids car. Cheap to maintain, no m tax and the n52 is pretty bullet proof.

[KPop]

(For context, I just bought a 22k-mile 2009 E90 M3 6MT as a pure weekend back-road fun car that's otherwise a battery-tendered garage queen 99% of the time.)

As others have pointed out, the E90 M3 was only offered from 2008 - 2011. If you want a refined, V8 sports sedan in the $30k-40k used price range that you can option with a manual transmission, the E90 M3 is probably your best bet. Your options for alternative cars with the same configuration are very, very limited (B7 RS4, prior gen CTS-V, Chevy SS, E39 M5, 550i...and that's it!). Now if you're open to an automatic, your options probably double, but staying in budget will be tricky. Alternatively, the E90 335i M-Sport uses hydraulic steering and if you throw a JB4 or Dinan tune on it, you'll have M3 power for about half the cost...

Back to M3. I'm assuming this would be your only car and a daily driver, right? In that case, I'd absolutely recommend budgeting around $5k for throttle actuators and rod bearings. While BMW never published exact failure rates, there are enough reported cases by owners such that I'd consider it a necessary insurance policy that you hopefully will never need to spend. It's not all doom and gloom, though, as there are also many owners deep in the 5-figure mileage range with no issues.

Otherwise, I recently started a 5-page thread on why I thought my E90 M3 was too refined for my taste, though after some discussion, I'm seeing it as part of the point to the M3's Jekyl and Hyde personality: good and fast enough for the occasional track day, but comfy enough for long drives or a commute. The steering is noticeably more alive than in the M235i and just about every other electric-assist BMW in production today, including the F80 M3.

That aside, it will be expensive to maintain if you're putting on a lot of miles. Consumables like brakes and tires are very expensive. Major services aren't cheap either, so you'll want to find a good indy mechanic or learn to DIY. If I needed another daily driver, I would not have bought an E90 M3, rather I'd have gone with a 2015+ Chevy SS 6MT with magnetic ride, or a prior-gen CTS-V. While the S65 V8 is a brilliant motor that begs you to wind it out on a mountain road, it does feel a bit tame around town where you often don't have enough distance between cars to get up into the higher-revs where this engine makes most of its power. For daily driving, torque is a wonderful thing.

As for Tesla, while I respect their technology and absurd acceleration party tricks, let's face it...it's a rolling computer that can drive itself. Not really my idea of a fun car to drive and certainly not in the same spirit as an E90 M3.

[Montaver]

E9x m3 is a great choice as lots of people have explained

Big difference between lease and finance, one is a rental the other your committed. Also depends on mileage, the M3 is very thirsty. Good e90 examples will take a bit of time to find.

Personally in your price range I'd get an RS3. Fantastic characterful engine (with the sports exhaust sounds mega), excellent chassis, practical, beautifully appointed interior.

[pbonsalb]

If you liked the E92 335i, why not buy an E90 335i? Cheap and easily modded. E90M3 is also worth looking at, but obviously costs more and may not be the best choice if finances are a concern. If you are tall, the rear facing car seat will have to go on the passenger side so I hope your wife is not as tall. 5 series has more room if you need it but is not quite as fun to drive.

[srmast1]

Originally Posted by pimp4cheddar

So...my lease is up on my M235i. I love the car...but we're thinking of having kid(s) within the next year so I need a 4 door. I had an E92 335i 6spd and I miss that chassis bad and after going to the F20 with electric steering...I miss the E90 feel.

I don't have many options but I wanted to keep my payment pretty low (under $500 a month) and I couldn't figure out what would be an engaging car for under $500 (finance or lease). I was thinking of maybe a new 5 Series 530i as a lease but I think I want to own my next car (and the 530i doesn't seem like something that'll put a huge smile on my face every day).


So I'm stuck...am I making a huge mistake? Is buying a used car like this just asking for painful repairs? The car will be out of warranty...so I'll be on my own. I'd be looking for a 2011.5 - 2013 to avoid RB repairs and most small kinks.


Thoughts? Do any owners have a warranty that's worth considering?

Should I be looking at other cars? I considered a used Tesla S (I know I know...but I can get a 2-3 year old one for around $35k and I'd save on gas).

I am in your shoes. I have a 11 yr old step son and planning on (hopefully) making some children of my own shortly. The e90 would be ok for 2 kids, but 1 kid + 1 baby potentially means diaper bags, stroller, and all the other crap that you haul while hauling a baby. Taking the whole family and equipment in that one car would be tough. And that's just say..going to the park. I'm sure people do it, but I think an suv or (ugh..gag) van would be a better fit size-wise. Even a 5 series would be better. I am considering finding a low mile 2013 to 2015 X5M once a baby arrives. I don't want to let go of the e90 m3, but if I was to do it, I would do it for a larger M vehicle and I think the X5M fits the bill nicely. 3rd row seating would be nice too, if possible to find. I know it's not a "pure" M vehicle but I don't care. It's a bad ass beast and family friendly as well.

[1MOREMOD]

Don't do it save the e90 for someone else

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by KPop

As for Tesla, while I respect their technology and absurd acceleration party tricks, let's face it...it's a rolling computer that can drive itself. Not really my idea of a fun car to drive and certainly not in the same spirit as an E90 M3.

Well put!

[loveskiing]

Originally Posted by FrozenAg

Probably blasphemous on this forum, but what about a new S3/Golf R or a used S4?

Your credentials for this forum have been revoked for 30 days due to blasphemous thoughts...next time the penalty will be worse...you will have to stand on the local street corner in the busiest part of town wearing a sign that spells out your transgressions for all to see

[pimp4cheddar]

Originally Posted by Blindside_137

Well if you want E90 M3 you are limited to 2008-2011.

As far as RB's go, it's really hit or miss and I wouldn't say the 2011-2013's are safe. But it seems like most would advise new owners to go ahead and do preventive maintenance and just swap the bearings out so you have peace of mind. Other than that and throttle actuators the E9x M3 is fairly reliable as far as M cars are concerned.

With regard to cars in general, if you are worried about maintenance of the M3 and miss the E9x why not another 335i or even a 328i in E90 form. Those run low 20k range for 50k miles. Payments would be in the 300 a month range. They are great cars and plenty of fun to drive.

Obviously haven't looked into the years and changes that much for the E9x M3's but that explains why I never find 2012 or 2013 sedans lol

I had an E92 335i for a few years but the N54 was as reliable as a crackhead... I can never do it again. 4 fuel pumps, 2 sets of coil packs, etc...not worth the headache.

Originally Posted by GRUESOM3

If it's your only car I wouldn't do a e90 m3 especially with kids on way.

I have a e90 6mt rwd 328i and it's a perfect daily and kids car. Cheap to maintain, no m tax and the n52 is pretty bullet proof.

I appreciate the insight buddy. If I was to get something non-m...it would probably be just an F30 335i lease (B58 engine seems very nice). The issue is the steering will still feel disconnected like it does in my m235i and honestly - I'd be leasing again. Not the worst move...but I do want to truly value my time in the car as it's one of my true enjoyments and I'm sure with the future scenario with a kid or two...I'd need my "personal time".

Originally Posted by KPop

(For context, I just bought a 22k-mile 2009 E90 M3 6MT as a pure weekend back-road fun car that's otherwise a battery-tendered garage queen 99% of the time.)

As others have pointed out, the E90 M3 was only offered from 2008 - 2011. If you want a refined, V8 sports sedan in the $30k-40k used price range that you can option with a manual transmission, the E90 M3 is probably your best bet. Your options for alternative cars with the same configuration are very, very limited (B7 RS4, prior gen CTS-V, Chevy SS, E39 M5, 550i...and that's it!). Now if you're open to an automatic, your options probably double, but staying in budget will be tricky. Alternatively, the E90 335i M-Sport uses hydraulic steering and if you throw a JB4 or Dinan tune on it, you'll have M3 power for about half the cost...

Back to M3. I'm assuming this would be your only car and a daily driver, right? In that case, I'd absolutely recommend budgeting around $5k for throttle actuators and rod bearings. While BMW never published exact failure rates, there are enough reported cases by owners such that I'd consider it a necessary insurance policy that you hopefully will never need to spend. It's not all doom and gloom, though, as there are also many owners deep in the 5-figure mileage range with no issues.

That aside, it will be expensive to maintain if you're putting on a lot of miles. Consumables like brakes and tires are very expensive. Major services aren't cheap either, so you'll want to find a good indy mechanic or learn to DIY. If I needed another daily driver, I would not have bought an E90 M3, rather I'd have gone with a 2015+ Chevy SS 6MT with magnetic ride, or a prior-gen CTS-V. While the S65 V8 is a brilliant motor that begs you to wind it out on a mountain road, it does feel a bit tame around town where you often don't have enough distance between cars to get up into the higher-revs where this engine makes most of its power. For daily driving, torque is a wonderful thing.

I drive about 15k miles a year so it'll get major use. I'm thinking this was just a hoop dream and it won't be ideal for my lifestyle...considering lack of warranty. The gas doesn't bother me...but the potential repairs would and this is what I fear. A $500 car payment monthly + repairs immediately puts me into the scenario of just financing an F80 M3 lol

Originally Posted by Montaver

E9x m3 is a great choice as lots of people have explained

Big difference between lease and finance, one is a rental the other your committed. Also depends on mileage, the M3 is very thirsty. Good e90 examples will take a bit of time to find.

Personally in your price range I'd get an RS3. Fantastic characterful engine (with the sports exhaust sounds mega), excellent chassis, practical, beautifully appointed interior.

I think I might just have to search elsewhere for other car options (I was hoping not to...but it is what it is).

Originally Posted by srmast1

I am in your shoes. I have a 11 yr old step son and planning on (hopefully) making some children of my own shortly. The e90 would be ok for 2 kids, but 1 kid + 1 baby potentially means diaper bags, stroller, and all the other crap that you haul while hauling a baby. Taking the whole family and equipment in that one car would be tough. And that's just say..going to the park. I'm sure people do it, but I think an suv or (ugh..gag) van would be a better fit size-wise. Even a 5 series would be better. I am considering finding a low mile 2013 to 2015 X5M once a baby arrives. I don't want to let go of the e90 m3, but if I was to do it, I would do it for a larger M vehicle and I think the X5M fits the bill nicely. 3rd row seating would be nice too, if possible to find. I know it's not a "pure" M vehicle but I don't care. It's a bad ass beast and family friendly as well.

Great insight.

Personally my wife would be buying an SUV and she wants 3 rows. I will most likely never own an SUV but a 4 door car would fit the bill!




I appreciate all the replies - I truly do! I'm obviously planning early as my lease is due back this upcoming November...but I know searching for a garage queen is quite the process and also extremely time consuming - so if this is the route I go down, I'd need to allocate a few months to do so which is why I'm thinking about this now.

[LVI]

No offense but this is not the right car for the $500/mo car buyer/shopper.

[srmast1]

Unless you DIY, 15k miles a year is going to get very expensive for maintenance with these cars. Also, unless you put down a decent chunk of cash and have awesome credit, or the car is old or has many miles, it will be difficult to get a $500 a month car payment. Just fyi.

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by pimp4cheddar

I had an E92 335i for a few years but the N54 was as reliable as a crackhead... I can never do it again. 4 fuel pumps, 2 sets of coil packs, etc

We have had our 08 535xit with N54 for over 7 years. The fuel pump was fixed by recall under warranty before we owned it and we have had no issues. Has been very reliable. I service it. In the nearly 100k miles we have owned it, the battery, vanos solenoids, coil packs, front control arm bushings, and a rear wheel bearing have gone. Other than that, it’s just been maintenance— fluids, brakes, filters, some gaskets, a carbon and goo cleaning. The JB4 wakes it up nicely. I doubt the newer B58 will be much better as it ages, other than benefiting from BMW’s fix of the fuel pump problems years ago, but by spending more money on a newer car you do get a newer car — spend enough and you get one with some warranty remaining.

[JAYBLS]

There are good aftermarket warranties for used cars. I'd argue that because you don't plan to keep this next car, it's an opportunity to get a used E90 M3 with a warranty. If you love driving, you'll want to keep it. You're obviously not worried about resale value if you're considering a lease. Does anything else have 400hp and hydraulic steering? If monthly payment, driving character, and four doors are your only parameters, there is absolutely nothing out there better than the E90 M3. However, maintenance and gas costs do approach unreasonable on this platform. Are you willing to pay a little extra for an almost exotic driving experience every single day? If not, do not get an E9x M.

[spazzyfry123]

I drive my E90 M3 errday and put the miles on thick. Just my work commute amounts to nearly 20k miles a year. And you best believe we take the M to anything we do outside of work. Put probably a thousand holiday miles on the car this past week doing the family thing.

I have found the car to be extremely reliable (knock on wood). You definitely have to pay the M tax when it comes to repairing and maintaining. At my annual mileage, I'll be paying about $1000 a year in just oil changes for example. I bet if the S65 didn't sound as good as it did, I could probably hear the fuel being pushed through the lines at the rate it drinks. But it isn't miles per gallon, it's smiles per gallon!

Do eet...

[pimp4cheddar]

Originally Posted by lawrence1

No offense but this is not the right car for the $500/mo car buyer/shopper.

No offense at all...that's my budget and I've put a lot of thought into it. Like many others here...I

Originally Posted by srmast1

Unless you DIY, 15k miles a year is going to get very expensive for maintenance with these cars. Also, unless you put down a decent chunk of cash and have awesome credit, or the car is old or has many miles, it will be difficult to get a $500 a month car payment. Just fyi.

I've done the math many ways...$500 is very possible. The issue is anything above and beyond that would require repair.

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

We have had our 08 535xit with N54 for over 7 years. The fuel pump was fixed by recall under warranty before we owned it and we have had no issues. Has been very reliable. I service it. In the nearly 100k miles we have owned it, the battery, vanos solenoids, coil packs, front control arm bushings, and a rear wheel bearing have gone. Other than that, it’s just been maintenance— fluids, brakes, filters, some gaskets, a carbon and goo cleaning. The JB4 wakes it up nicely. I doubt the newer B58 will be much better as it ages, other than benefiting from BMW’s fix of the fuel pump problems years ago, but by spending more money on a newer car you do get a newer car — spend enough and you get one with some warranty remaining.

That's awesome! Unfortunately I haven't had that type of luck and I personally don't know anyone locally that doesn't have the fear of their N54 335i not starting every morning. I've been there for many years...can't bring myself to go back. My focus is definitely not on the N54 335i though...



I think I'll be checking out competitive brands but there isn't much out there that has even caught my eye...