[Yamerous]

Where's this one going then?

I would hope Putin realises that he's just pushed it too far this time and backs off a little, but that doesn't seem to be his way. He's been flying into NATO airspaces for a while now, including UK. I also saw reports that Russian subs were testing out our waters again in Scotland - we had to ask France and Canada to help us track them with some of their helicopters!

Putin's losing face at home as bombing Syria isn't going completely his way, so these two things add up to a very worrying scenario.

[Nick Malaka]

Originally Posted by Yamyamyou

Where's this one going then?

I would hope Putin realises that he's just pushed it too far this time and backs off a little, but that doesn't seem to be his way. He's been flying into NATO airspaces for a while now, including UK. I also saw reports that Russian subs were testing out our waters again in Scotland - we had to ask France and Canada to help us track them with some of their helicopters!

Putin's losing face at home as bombing Syria isn't going completely his way, so these two things add up to a very worrying scenario.

Putin's satisfaction ratings at home are still very high.

Any problems and we can send Brigand to sort them out.

I can sleep easy

[....,,,,..,,..]

Originally Posted by Yamyamyou

Where's this one going then?

I would hope Putin realises that he's just pushed it too far this time and backs off a little, but that doesn't seem to be his way. He's been flying into NATO airspaces for a while now, including UK. I also saw reports that Russian subs were testing out our waters again in Scotland - we had to ask France and Canada to help us track them with some of their helicopters!

Putin's losing face at home as bombing Syria isn't going completely his way, so these two things add up to a very worrying scenario.

Turkey fucked up here.

That was a major escalation from radio to shooting down.

Would have expected F16's to escort them out of air space.

Also very 2 faced of Turkey who are bombing Kurds.


Russia has not technically entered UK air Space yet, they have been doing runs around northern Norway and Baltic.

Not heard about us asking for help tracking helicopters, subs yes.

Yes we have a huge hole in our airborne maritime capabilities.

NATO airforces have been handling the air threat, however there is no air response to either surface or sub surface threats.

[Wills2]

It would be well for your government to consider that having your ships and ours, your aircraft and ours, in such proximity... is inherently DANGEROUS. Wars have begun that way, Mr. Ambassador.

[mm0wax]

The Hunt for Red October?

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by mm0wax

The Hunt for Red October?

Correct! Another apt quote:

This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it.

[CIWS]

Odds are the Russians will not outright retaliate, however I would expect to see Russian fighters start to escort any strike aircraft that will fly missions in the vicinity of the Turkish border from now on. If the Turks send their F-16s back out to perform an intercept then we'll see who the victor is.

The Russians have already been deploying point defense SAM equipment to their bases in Syria, the Pantsir-S1 and there have been some "leaked" photos showing what looks like the S-400 in Latakia as well. Neither of those are there to use against the rebels.

But how about those rebels whacking the Russian rescue helos with their TOWS ?

[Tengocity]

So disappointed.... I thought this was going to be about some militant Poultry attempting to avoid their inevitable Christmas/thanksgiving fates!

[SteveChester]

Goodbye Turkey!

[....,,,,..,,..]

Originally Posted by CIWS

Odds are the Russians will not outright retaliate, however I would expect to see Russian fighters start to escort any strike aircraft that will fly missions in the vicinity of the Turkish border from now on. If the Turks send their F-16s back out to perform an intercept then we'll see who the victor is.

The Russians have already been deploying point defense SAM equipment to their bases in Syria, the Pantsir-S1 and there have been some "leaked" photos showing what looks like the S-400 in Latakia as well. Neither of those are there to use against the rebels.

But how about those rebels whacking the Russian rescue helos with their TOWS ?

They just need to fly a combat mix of SU30 /27 in SEAD / CAP role TBH.

As for kit the Russians have in Syria.

Back in around 2013 they provided them P800 Anti Ship missiles (carrier killers) and also S300, now replaced with S400.

It was a completely ridiculous decision by turkey, pretty much they will suffer both economically and militarily.

The S400 can take out pretty much any aircraft up to around 250 miles away.

Also I reckon Alpaslan Çelik will be lucky to survive past Christmas.

The bad bits are the shooting at pilots and helicopter on a rescue mission.

Also the obvious jubilation of the rebels killing the pilot / Nav and then Obama publicly backing the rebels shows what an utter smeg head Obama is.


The Greeks and the Turks routinely infringe on each other's air space, circa 10 miles etc, no shouting there.....

Turkey deserve what they have reaped.

[xenon]

Originally Posted by Brigand

Turkey deserve what they have reaped.

Perhaps - but as a NATO member it means we could be reaping their harvest too.

[CIWS]

Originally Posted by Brigand

Back in around 2013 they provided them P800 Anti Ship missiles (carrier killers) and also S300, now replaced with S400.

Those "carrier killers", most were bombed by the Israelis in a warehouse in Damascus shortly after they arrived. Israel concerned they would go to Hezbollah. Assad has tried to use a couple of others as a land attack weapon against the rebels (failed). Assad never got the S-300s from the Russians although they were talking about supplying them to him. He became too far in debt to the Russians from all the hardware he was already given and they cut the "sale" off as well as the supply of any other major weapons like Scuds. Part of the reason he switched to barrel bombs. Those S-300s are now going to Iran. The S-400s there are for the Russians guarding their bases in Latakia not Assad.

Originally Posted by Brigand

The bad bits are the shooting at pilots and helicopter on a rescue mission.

Also the obvious jubilation of the rebels killing the pilot / Nav and then Obama publicly backing the rebels shows what an utter smeg head Obama is.

The Russians or anyone else coming down in a parachute there in enemy territory has been fired upon by the ground, that's nothing new. But that said, the TOWs that are now being supplied in much greater numbers to the rebels are having an impact (pun) on Assad and his buddies there. There are no IS forces in that part of the country. Any Russian bombing in that part is to strike at the more moderate "western backed" forces despite what Russia says they are doing there.

Please don't even get me started on President Obama and his handling of this entire situation.

[dangerous_al]

There have always been minor incursions in other countries airspace, which usually just results in a scrambled fighter response with escort out of the area. Firing on an aircraft for such a minor incursion seems a very aggressive response and I really don't understand what Turkey were thinking. If they think they can win a war against Russia they are delusional. I think it was a stupid and totally inappropriate response on their part and I think the Russians have been incredibly restrained. I am with Russia on this one

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by mm0wax

The Hunt for Red October?

One ping only.......

[CIWS]

Originally Posted by dangerous_al

There have always been minor incursions in other countries airspace, which usually just results in a scrambled fighter response with escort out of the area. Firing on an aircraft for such a minor incursion seems a very aggressive response and I really don't understand what Turkey were thinking. If they think they can win a war against Russia they are delusional. I think it was a stupid and totally inappropriate response on their part and I think the Russians have been incredibly restrained. I am with Russia on this one

The Russians have made incursions into their airspace multiple times since arriving there. Turkey warned them they would no longer tolerate them after multiple warnings for the past events. Also the Russians had been bombing the Turkmans near the Turkish border and just a few days prior to this the Turks summoned the Russian envoy and warned them against continuing to do so. Russia flew across a section of their airspace to fly missions into the Turkman areas and bomb them. Did Turkey go too far ? Perhaps. But part of this whole issue is many countries put out protests and warnings and then never follow up on them. Our President is one of the worst examples of this, and so maybe the Russians felt the Turks were all warning and no action. They just proved they are now dead serious. It just means Russia now knows they will have to plan accordingly, and I think we all understand they will.

[mm0wax]

Originally Posted by Chris The Manx

One ping only.......

That's all right, Mr Ryan. My Morse is so rusty, I could be sending him dimensions on Playmate of the Month.

[SteveChester]

Originally Posted by Yamyamyou

Where's this one going then?

I would hope Putin realises that he's just pushed it too far this time and backs off a little, but that doesn't seem to be his way. He's been flying into NATO airspaces for a while now, including UK. I also saw reports that Russian subs were testing out our waters again in Scotland - we had to ask France and Canada to help us track them with some of their helicopters!

Putin's losing face at home as bombing Syria isn't going completely his way, so these two things add up to a very worrying scenario.

I reckon the bloke that pressed the button has got a massive set of bollocks.....

[....,,,,..,,..]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

I reckon the bloke that pressed the button has got a massive set of bollocks.....

Whatever F16 pilot fired the missile should be well in the shit.

Totally fucking pointless, unprofessional and expected from the fucking Turks.

100% agree with Putin over this, that Turkey will stab you in the back.

Back in 91-92 onwards, while we were carrying out aid drops, covering the Northern No Fly zone.

Our planes would take off on aid or Cap missions.

The Turks?

Fully bombed up Phantoms would take off first thing and then return later without bombs.

They were bombing the fuck out of the Kurds.


It's always been a liability having them in NATO, we definitely can't have them in the EU.

[Kal101]

Strange thing is the navigator has now appeared to be interviewed saying they weren't in Turkish air space. Earlier reports stated both were killed or did I mis hear ???

Apparently the fire order came from Turkish president himself so they can't blame the pilots.

Going a bit ott on the cock waving perhaps !!

[....,,,,..,,..]

When we were out in Turkey (many years ago) we really fucked them off as well, blacked out entire east of Turkey... Oops.

That's what happens with low flying Death Bombers







Hopefully NATO will reign in Turkey.

Although they will have a few years of no Russian tourists and likely no new gas supply.

[CIWS]

Originally Posted by Brigand

Although they will have a few years of no Russian tourists and likely no new gas supply.

That gas is certainly one way Russia will retaliate.