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      09-26-2017, 03:53 PM   #89
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Great news that this is finally happening!

Only negative is that it is fwd. that will simply compete with mercedes and audi on a level playing field along the same classic terms where audi wins on interior and amg wins with engine. Bmw can compete on driving characterists and badge.

Why not absolutely wipe the competition out of the water by simply making it rwd? Yes it will cost more but can you really put a price on the massive amount of positive press and enthusiast support such a car would get for being an e46m3 reincarnate. Apparently the bean counters at bmw can
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      09-26-2017, 04:29 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
I disagree with that point. It is no different from having both an M2 coupe and M4 coupe today, or really, the 2 Series coupe/convertible along side the 4 Series coupe/convertible.
Actually, it is different. There is a reason why there is no M4 Gran Coupe. Because it would take away from the M3 sedan. Just like there is no current 2 series Gran Coupe and M2 Gran Coupe. The 2 series Gran Coupe would steal sales from the 3 series sedan, and so would the M2 Gran Coupe. An M2 Gran Coupe would be akin to the e46 M3 sedan that they never built. I do think that BMW thought, rightfully so, that the 6 series GC and M6 GC would not steal sales from the 5 and the M5, because those are two different customers who would looking to buy a 6 GC/M6 GC and the 5/M5.

The 3 series is BMW bread and butter, and they will NOT have another car, especially one that is lower on the totem pole, to upstage it. Nor would they have the more attractive 4 GC be made into a M4 GC and steal sales from the legendary named M3
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      09-26-2017, 04:38 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by KGB_123_99 View Post
I got excited there for a second until I saw the FWD platform. I knew the position of the front wheel relative to the windshield somehow didn't look right.

If BMW had a RWD platform, they could easily compete against the A3 and CLA on driving dynamics alone. Now that I see it's a FWD platform, that advantage is negated.

BMW keeps going down the wrong money-saving path.
There is nothing wrong with a good FWD platform. Don't get your panties in a bunch, it's not like they're replacing a 4dr rwd car with a 4 door FWD car.

Don't buy a FWD car if you don't want one...
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      09-26-2017, 04:42 PM   #92
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Oxymoron: FWD BWM

I need a four-door that fits in my garage. The M3 is too long. I was holding out hope that the 2 GC would fit the bill. I won't buy a FWD BMW. So sad.

I'll have to hang on to my 2002 325i.
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      09-26-2017, 05:01 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Red Bread View Post
Just spitballing something here, but with Mini sales down to minuscule numbers, and an increasing number of fwd based BMWs, is there a possibility that they?ll just shutter MINI in the near future?
MINI Might be down in the US market. Globally the brand has just had another highly successful August. The IAA illustrated two concepts that will make production so there will be the sustainable option as well as the Batshit crazy option in the JCW GP. The new Countryman E has caused a huge impact in the European market.
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      09-26-2017, 05:02 PM   #94
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That’ll sell like the cakes that are hot.

2019 seems so far away though.
Disagree. Bmw keeps going down the food chain...

Nobody wants a 50k 2 series...

Now they?ll have to hire bodies to update this line, instead of being focused like Mercedes.
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      09-26-2017, 05:05 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
As I said, the codes are merely corroborating information. Still, notice that there are no UKL vehicles with codes F42/F43 coming either. So, if BMW were planning to use UKL for the coupe/convertible, those are right there for the taking. F41 is the next 1 Series hatch, known to be moving to UKL, after which they skip to F44 which is this new 2 Series GC also known to be built on UKL. Circumstantial? Technically, sure. But very strong circumstance, I would say.

However, the real evidence is Van Meel's recent statement that M Division is sticking with the I6 and will not build four cylinder models. He would not come out and say that at this time - with nothing forcing him to come forward about such things - if products were not in the works, and if he were not 100% sure he will not be eating his words in just a few short years. We can take his statement to mean that the next M2, M3, and M4 will each be I6 powered. After that generation? Who knows.

In any case, if the M2 is going to be powered by an I6, then it is going to be built on a RWD platform. And if the M2 is going to be on a RWD platform, then so will the 2 Series coupe (and convertible) on which it must be based.



No, not true at all. The F22/F23/F87 just had their LCI and will not be replaced until 2021 according to current inside information. It is way too early for the next generation to be out testing. In fact, even the next generation 4 Series Coupe has not yet been seen, and that is due in 2020.

By contrast, this new 2 GC is due in 2019, which is why it is now out in the wild testing.



As far as I am concerned, these are the facts. You too will be convinced eventually. But go ahead and take all the time you need - you've got years to allow yourself to believe.



Yes, and it will almost surely power the next M3 and M4 just as it is known to be powering the new X3 M and X4 M.

Quite possibly, maybe I'd even say probably, it will indeed power the next M2 as well. The only other choice would be some version of the B58 approaching 400hp. That cannot be ruled out, but I think the fact that they are promoting the S55 to the M2 "CS" now suggests that for the next generation, they will start with the M motor right out of the gate. That's just my hunch, but I think it make sense.
The 2er Gran Coupe/M Perfomance will be FWD based with xDrive available.
The next generation of 2er Coupe,Cabrio and M2 will be RWD based with xDrive on some models.
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      09-26-2017, 05:18 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IS3andME View Post
Actually, it is different.
It isn’t. In fact, the M2 and M4 Coupe are actually *more* similar to each other than an M2 GC and M3 would be.

Quote:
There is a reason why there is no M4 Gran Coupe. Because it would take away from the M3 sedan.
That’s not the case. According to BMW M, they decided against it because of the extra weight of that vehicle compared to the sedan. Perhaps you disbelieve that. You prerogative, but your theory is nevertheless complete speculation.

Quote:
Just like there is no current 2 series Gran Coupe and M2 Gran Coupe. The 2 series Gran Coupe would steal sales from the 3 series sedan, and so would the M2 Gran Coupe. An M2 Gran Coupe would be akin to the e46 M3 sedan that they never built.
No more than a 2 Series Coupe/Convertible does from the 4 Series Coupe/Convertible. Probably there is some canibalization, but it has obviously not ruled out having both. And again, those two are even *more* similar than the 2 GC would be to the 3 Sedan.

Quote:
The 3 series is BMW bread and butter, and they will NOT have another car, especially one that is lower on the totem pole, to upstage it.
Sure, nor did anyone suggest that they would. Instead, they would simply design the M2 GC to not perform as well as the M3 in the same way they’ve designed the M2 Coupe to not outshine the M4 Coupe. This is elementary since, if it existed today, an M2 GC would share the chassis and drivetrain with the Coupe.

Quote:
Nor would they have the more attractive 4 GC be made into a M4 GC and steal sales from the legendary named M3
Nonsense. If they felt an M4 GC were to make a viable product and increase overall sales rather than simply stealing M3 sales, they’d build one. They may yet in a future generation.
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      09-26-2017, 05:25 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The 2er Gran Coupe/M Perfomance will be FWD based with xDrive available.
The next generation of 2er Coupe,Cabrio and M2 will be RWD based with xDrive on some models.
Thank you for the corroborating statement SCOTT. Another voice of wisdom from the ether.
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      09-26-2017, 05:50 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The 2er Gran Coupe/M Perfomance will be FWD based with xDrive available.
The next generation of 2er Coupe,Cabrio and M2 will be RWD based with xDrive on some models.
Boom - all oracles are in agreement.
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      09-26-2017, 06:08 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEM-S4 View Post
I already have a deposit down
On a car that will never exist?

If you are talking about the F87 M2 "CS", that's not what he was talking about and not relevant to this thread.
No - I have a deposit down so I'm first in line for M2 GC and 240 (or whatever) GC if / when they are available.
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      09-26-2017, 06:10 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtoosexy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEM-S4
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Originally Posted by mtoosexy View Post
they can take my money right now!!!!
I already have a deposit down
On a M2GC? wowza
Yeah my dealer worked with me so I only needed to do one deposit. Basically I'm first in line for 2GC at his shop regardless of what one they make or I want. So if they bring out M2 and 240 GC for example I can pick.
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      09-26-2017, 07:37 PM   #101
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Oh great. It?s BMW?s take on the classically garbage Mercedes CLA.
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      09-26-2017, 07:40 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BEM-S4
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtoosexy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BEM-S4
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtoosexy View Post
they can take my money right now!!!!
I already have a deposit down
On a M2GC? wowza
Yeah my dealer worked with me so I only needed to do one deposit. Basically I'm first in line for 2GC at his shop regardless of what one they make or I want. So if they bring out M2 and 240 GC for example I can pick.
Sweet , I'm 1st on the list for a 4th quarter M2 allocation as well as 1st on the list for the CS. I would love an M2 Gran coupe but I can't wait till 2019(maybe?). Will most likely keep my RS4 and then pick up an M2 to mod and track. If the dealer mark-up on the CS to high, Then I'll probably pick up an M3 and do the Dinan upgrades. 4 door would be handy for two kids still in car seats.
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      09-26-2017, 08:20 PM   #103
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I'm unsure if people are being sarcastic in their enthusiasm for another mini pretending to be a BMW?

4 doors on a m240i would be fine but this is a joke
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      09-26-2017, 08:48 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BEM-S4 View Post
No - I have a deposit down so I'm first in line for M2 GC and 240 (or whatever) GC if / when they are available.
Why not go all in with a hefty deposit for the 2020 Z8 with the naturally aspirated 4L V10 and I think it has carbon fiber windows and tires with unicorn skin seats?

I’m kidding - I’m not quite that big of an a-hole.

But on a serious note, if you are down with the 300hp-ish B48-powered M235i xDrive GC, good on you for securing the first spot at your dealership. Otherwise, you are going to be asking for that deposit back come 2019 when the vehicle is revealed.
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      09-26-2017, 09:00 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
However, the real evidence is Van Meel's recent statement that M Division is sticking with the I6 and will not build four cylinder models. He would not come out and say that at this time - with nothing forcing him to come forward about such things - if products were not in the works, and if he were not 100% sure he will not be eating his words in just a few short years. We can take his statement to mean that the next M2, M3, and M4 will each be I6 powered. After that generation? Who knows.

In any case, if the M2 is going to be powered by an I6, then it is going to be built on a RWD platform. And if the M2 is going to be on a RWD platform, then so will the 2 Series coupe (and convertible) on which it must be based.
He just said M car won't be powered by 4 cyl engine only.
I also remember that he said it's possible for them to consider hybrid on M car. I'm curious why he even mention about it.

I cannot believe BMW will have 2 separate chassis for 2 series since 2 series sales is not that huge for BMW. is it?
Maybe next gen 2er coupe won't get big chassis update. Then it makes sense since the updated chassis won't cost them much.

If what you said turns out to be true, you must have some inside connection.
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      09-26-2017, 09:08 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mdecisive View Post
An M2 GC w/S55 would be the perfect bruiser
You mean the M3? :
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      09-26-2017, 09:08 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The 2er Gran Coupe/M Perfomance will be FWD based with xDrive available.
The next generation of 2er Coupe,Cabrio and M2 will be RWD based with xDrive on some models.
Yawn....
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      09-26-2017, 09:12 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Move to where? An underpowered Subaru BRZ or Toyota FRS? A Miata? An i3?

Or instead to an A3/S3/RS3, CLA/CLA45 with "cheap FWD", the latter of which with enough power to blow the doors right off many RWD vehicles?

Or maybe instead a Focus RS, Golf R based on lesser models with "cheap FWD"?

Or maybe a WRX or WRX STi? Those at least have a longitudinal motor, right? But wait, the Impreza from which they borrow is still available in some countries with - you guessed it - FWD.

Or, they can stay in a G42/G43 coupe/convertible 2/M2, still have RWD, still have the option of AWD in the non M-models, still have the option for an I6 in both M and M Performance models, and still have as much as 400hp+ under the hood.

Which do you think will happen?
Maybe mustang, camaro. GM may even get the ATS right one of these days.
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      09-26-2017, 09:24 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srswans View Post
I need a four-door that fits in my garage. The M3 is too long. I was holding out hope that the 2 GC would fit the bill. I won't buy a FWD BMW. So sad.

I'll have to hang on to my 2002 325i.
find an E46 ZHP and put in an S54 and a decent suspension.
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      09-26-2017, 10:32 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Teufel_Hunden View Post
Except for the 6 series, the grand coupes are hideous.
100% agree the 4GC is bad. Hopefully the 2GC they got right.
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