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      06-27-2019, 09:23 PM   #1
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Electrek: BMW says there’s no demand for all-electric cars – they are wrong

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BMW Leadership...*sigh*. Lost for words.

https://electrek.co/2019/06/27/bmw-n...electric-cars/
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      06-28-2019, 01:18 AM   #2
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Electric cars have 2% global market share. People need to stop thinking everyone is going to be driving electric cars in 5 years.
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      06-28-2019, 01:22 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alex2364 View Post
Electric cars have 2% global market share. People need to stop thinking everyone is going to be driving electric cars in 5 years.
Don't forget 0-60 times. You can't mention EV without boasting about 0-60 times...it's just not what you do
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      06-28-2019, 04:06 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by alex2364 View Post
Electric cars have 2% global market share. People need to stop thinking everyone is going to be driving electric cars in 5 years.
Right, but key markets will be requiring car manufacturers to reduce emissions and increase fuel economy. The world is moving towards a conclusion. We can either be trailblazers or be left behind.
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      06-28-2019, 04:26 AM   #5
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Model 3 Sales
January. 6.500
February. 5.750
March 10.175
April 10.050
May 13.950

3 and 4 Series Sales
January 4.068
February. 5.064
March. 6.495
April. 4.856
May. 5.704

That's the definition of "head in sand" from an executive at BMW. Those are US numbers.
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      06-28-2019, 08:25 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alex2364 View Post
Electric cars have 2% global market share. People need to stop thinking everyone is going to be driving electric cars in 5 years.
At the same time, I think a lot more people than 2% of the market want electric vehicles, they just aren't mature enough (the infrastructure especially) for people to make the jump. Myself included.

I just pulled the trigger on a 440xi GC, and I'm very excited for it. At the same time, if this car existed with an electric powertrain, and there was a bit better support for it I'd want that.

My point is that I think way more people want it, but can't justify it at the moment. While that seems like an obvious statement, it's very different than the one BMW has put forward.
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      06-28-2019, 09:44 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vp View Post
Model 3 Sales
January. 6.500
February. 5.750
March 10.175
April 10.050
May 13.950

3 and 4 Series Sales
January 4.068
February. 5.064
March. 6.495
April. 4.856
May. 5.704

That's the definition of "head in sand" from an executive at BMW. Those are US numbers.
Not for nothing wasn't the model 3 just released in January after being pushed back for how long? Most of those numbers is after a long period of time taking deposits and customers waiting. So they were in extreme demand. You'll probably see the sales numbers fizzle down. Hell they are still probably trying to fill orders.
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      06-28-2019, 03:24 PM   #8
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I am not sure about the no demand part. After driving my i3 for a year I know my next car will be an ev as well. Hopefully BMW has sufficient and competitive offerings when I decide to upgrade.
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      06-28-2019, 04:17 PM   #9
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Duh. The range of the I3 probably works well for Europe. In the US, where distances traveled tend to stretch out (in greater Phoenix I think of anything with ten miles as my neighborhood), the range is too short. Of course, that can be somewhat lengthened with the range extender but it only extends it a little and, more importantly, at least to me, it is too underpowered. If BMW wants to have a range extender, it needs a bigger ICE. But, I don't think serial hybrids work that well in the US; we need parallel hybrids like my 530e.

Yes...there will continue to be ICE autos for a long time but the march to electrification is unstoppable. This is especially true in China which is the biggest market for BMW.

Head in the sand!
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      06-28-2019, 04:39 PM   #10
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https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/28/1...tive-overhyped

Quote:
BMW executive calls EVs 'overhyped' at company event about EVs

Someone didn’t get the message

BMW executive and board member Klaus Fröhlich told reporters this week that the shift to cars powered by electricity is "overhyped," and said that there is "no" consumer demand for them. Curiously, Fröhlich made these comments at an event where BMW proudly announced it will accelerate plans to release 25 cars that are partially or fully electric, moving the timeline up two years from 2025 to 2023.

Fröhlich said all-electric vehicles "cost more in terms of raw materials for batteries" than gas or hybrid cars, and added that those prices "could eventually worsen as demand for these raw materials increases." He also claimed that, broadly, there are "regulator requests for [all-electric vehicles], but no customer requests." Fröhlich said BMW could "flood" Europe with a million all-electric cars if it was able to offer a big government incentive, but claimed that "Europeans won't buy these things."


From what we see, [all-electric vehicles] are for China and California and everywhere else is better off with [plug-in hybrids] with good EV range," Fröhlich said. He added that he expects diesel engines to survive for at least 20 more years, and gas engines for at least 30

...
Ummmm... Ron... ?
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Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 06-28-2019 at 05:29 PM..
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      06-28-2019, 05:49 PM   #11
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Finally some semblance of sanity out of Germany/Munich
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      06-28-2019, 07:04 PM   #12
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It's going to build more battery models, but an exec says electrification is "overhyped"


https://driving.ca/bmw/auto-news/new...es-for-another

BMW may be heavily investing in electric vehicles, but it expects to continue building petroleum-fueled engines, with diesel lasting at least 20 years and gasoline another decade after that.

Speaking with Automotive News Europe, Klaus Fröhlich, BMW Group board member of development, said even with battery-electric and plug-in hybrids, he expects at least 80 per cent of the company’s vehicles will still have an internal combustion engine by 2025.

A “best assumption” would be just 30 per cent electrified sales by 2025, Fröhlich added.

“We see areas without a recharging infrastructure, such as Russia, the Middle East, and the western internal part of China, so they will rely on gasoline engines for another 10 to 15 years,” Fröhlich told the magazine. He said the coastal part of China, and cities like Beijing and Shanghai, will be battery-electric in about ten years, while Europe is more likely to embrace plug-in hybrids.

In the U.S., he expects battery-electrics to sell mainly on the west coast and in parts of the east coast, but they will not become mainstream vehicles. In order to create emissions credits for environmental regulations, the company will most likely offer sportier, more powerful BMW M plug-in hybrids to American (and no doubt Canadian) customers.

Fröhlich told Automotive News Europe that “the shift to electrification is overhyped,” and that battery-electric vehicles “cost more in terms of raw materials for batteries. This will continue and could eventually worsen, as demand for these raw materials increases.”

BMW will abandon a 1.5-L three-cylinder diesel it sells in Europe because it’s too costly to engineer it to comply with tightening emissions standards. Fröhlich also said the company won’t design a successor to the six-cylinder, 400-horsepower diesel in the 750d, since it’s too pricey and complicated to build due to its four turbochargers.

The automaker will continue to engineer four- and six-cylinder diesels, but with no more than three turbochargers. It’s working on a business case to continue its eight-cylinder gasoline engines, but will eventually drop its V12, which only sells about 5,000 copies per year globally — including at Rolls-Royce — and which has to be regularly updated to meet new emissions standards, especially in China.
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      06-28-2019, 08:06 PM   #13
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Yeah, the future appears to be electric, but I love the sound that my old fashioned 6 cylinder makes!
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      06-28-2019, 11:04 PM   #14
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Maybe it will be an inline electric motor?
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      06-29-2019, 01:46 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWModel3 View Post
BMW Corporate: i3 sales are slow therefore no demand for BEVs
Everyone else:
Duh. The range of the I3 probably works well for Europe. In the US, where distances traveled tend to stretch out (in greater Phoenix I think of anything with ten miles as my neighborhood), the range is too short. Of course, that can be somewhat lengthened with the range extender but it only extends it a little and, more importantly, at least to me, it is too underpowered. If BMW wants to have a range extender, it needs a bigger ICE. But, I don't think serial hybrids work that well in the US; we need parallel hybrids like my 530e.

Yes...there will continue to be ICE autos for a long time but the march to electrification is unstoppable. This is especially true in China which is the biggest market for BMW.

Head in the sand!
The i3 is a commuter car. More range would certainly be a plus, but my commute is 80 miles round trip. I think I'm on the upper spectrum of commute distances. In my opinion, the i3 is the perfect secondary companion car. I have an i3 and an M3 CS. It's a great combo. Personally, the 530e is not a substitute for an i3 simply because the operational costs are too high. The short electric only range is no good for me, although those with nice short commutes would benefit. Both the 530e and the i3 fill their own specific niches.

As far as being underpowered I have to strongly disagree. True, it's not anywhere near as quick as my 453hp M3 CS, but in city traffic it's the 0-30 that matters most along with the instant torque and tight maneuverability. It's lighter, smaller, and more nimble for city traffic than my M3 CS and your 530e. 0-30 in 3.1 seconds is not bad at all.
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      06-29-2019, 10:22 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vp View Post
Model 3 Sales
January. 6.500
February. 5.750
March 10.175
April 10.050
May 13.950

3 and 4 Series Sales
January 4.068
February. 5.064
March. 6.495
April. 4.856
May. 5.704

That's the definition of "head in sand" from an executive at BMW. Those are US numbers.
This means nothing if manufacturer/dealer incentives aren't factored in.
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      06-29-2019, 10:55 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
This means nothing if manufacturer/dealer incentives aren't factored in.
There are no Tesla dealers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240Newbie View Post
Not for nothing wasn't the model 3 just released in January after being pushed back for how long? Most of those numbers is after a long period of time taking deposits and customers waiting. So they were in extreme demand. You'll probably see the sales numbers fizzle down. Hell they are still probably trying to fill orders.
Model 3 was released long ago. And their sales have obliterated BMW 3/4 Series every month in 2018. In fact, their sales have blown past virtually every model out there.
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      06-30-2019, 10:41 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
This means nothing if manufacturer/dealer incentives aren't factored in.
The 3 and 4 series are also heavily incentivized.
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      06-30-2019, 08:41 PM   #19
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I don’t really care about the environment, but I did just pick up an i3s and it’s excellent. Sucks that they’re not keeping it going.
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      07-02-2019, 04:55 AM   #20
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Interesting thoughts from this guy wonder if he is doing the same mistake Nokia did when they underestimated the importance of Apple and the iphone launch by listetning way to much on their so called market analysts people, who pretty much are yes sayers.

Wonder what BMW's board of directors will say to his statements.

As far as i see people (no not the super car ethasuastist people but the regular folks who wants to go from A to B only) want EV cars but there is an issue with the infrastructure atm and charging times, range on the EV cars are improving drastically, with every year that passes.

But i guess we shall wait and see what the next excuse will be when infrastructure can't be used anymore nor charging times can be used as an excuse no more especially with the oncoming maxwell technology on the rise.

Or did the BMW Ceo just lose a big deal that caused the EV department of BMW to lose out on some good contracts which causes him to say something like this interesting.
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      07-02-2019, 05:51 AM   #21
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He backpedaled to the german press, saying his words were taken out of context and he mostly meant to comment on past buyer behavior.

But I haven't read it in detail I have to admit.
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      07-02-2019, 11:47 AM   #22
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If BMW really said this, I don't think they could be more wrong. It seems to me, for the vast majority of people commuting in a car or even just driving is a terrible/boring chore. I've seriously seen threads where people are bitching about having to get out of their car at gas stations to fill up. I don't understand how you could ever see this as an issue but that's neither here nor there.

I think the bottom line is the vast majority of people will go with what's the most convenient. If you can have a vehicle which you just plug in at night and go in the morning (and as long as the infrastructure is there), people are going to go for it. Folks like me who love driving just for the sake of it, love the sound of the motor, love rowing through the gears of a 6MT, are in the serious minority. Businesses have to go with what the majority of their customers want, this is obviously why we've seen such a massive reduction in available manual transmission cars over the past decade.

I certainly don't think EVs are anywhere close to being the majority of vehicles on the road, it might take decades for that to happen. However I think progress certainly dictates this will happen in the future.

ICE and 6MT will still be around for the rest of my life however, so in the end that's all which really matters to me.
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