Another interview w/ Frank van Meel, Head of BMW M (from Automotive Engineer)

[Outlaw 06]

Originally Posted by Law

You see, BMW's marketing has worked because this is exactly what they want people to think, that the current MPAs are some sort of offspring or descendants of the M535i, when it is far from the truth.

The M535i wasn't just a 5er with a sport package slapped with M-badges to help it sell better.
It was available only with a dogleg manual transmission and was equipped with a standard LSD from the factory (not "port install" or "dealer install").
Chassis and suspension components were modified/strengthened, shocks made by Bilstein, wheels by BBS, brake rotors had a thicker and vented construction, and Recaro seats were standard equipment.
Final assembly was finished by hand at the BMW Motorsport GmbH facility in Preussenstrasse.
Where it fell short of being a "full" Motorsport vehicle was that the motor was an M30 (BMW AG motor).
That all changed when they took the same formula above but stuck the M1's motor into the engine bay with the E28, spawning first M5.

Based on the above formula, neither the M235i or the X4 M40i, etc. are similar in philosophy or quality of construction.
The only thing they have in common is the "M" badge whilst not being full M-cars.
But understand that the M535i was developed by BMW Motorsport GmbH as a special vehicle, not as a segment filler designed to follow market trends.
That's the difference.

This is the essence of my disappointment with "mainstream" BMW too. The Z8 is an other example of BMW's old formula of producing special vehicles designed by BMW Motorsport GmbH. Unfortunately, this successful formula seems to have been completely abandoned by BMW now.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by W///

Wake me up when Mercedes offers a car that doesn't weight 4000 lbs and offer a MT.

Otherwise, no care.

The AMG's C63 is only 100 something pounds heavier than a M3. The manual is dead. Probably getting dropped from the next generation M5. That point is moot. The TT V8 under the hood of the AMG C63 is only 10 pounds heavier than the TT I6 under the hood of the M3.

[LimeRockM235]

stopped reading after i face palmed at V6 GTS....

[KevinM]

Originally Posted by W///

I honestly think the MT will go first, but we'll see.

Agreed.

[Bratva90]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

I had the pleasure of driving a C Coupe for an extended period of time. That package is superior to the 4 series. BMW needs to step up their game. We're falling behind. I'm all for innovation, and moving forward. It just hurts to see cars like the AMG GT, and the Rebadged VW R8 halo cars, while BMW is putting out 'Special Edition' cars like the M6 Competition Edition or our Halo car, the i8. Our competitors are thriving with Twin Turbo V8's and naturally aspirated V10's.

I understand that times have changed, but we can't just rest on our laurels. It's a sad day when you start hearing a Mercedes is 'more fun' to drive than it's BMW counterpart.

what he said

[GMe90]

I stopped reading the moment I came across the word "V6."

[Petr0lhead]

Interesting! Electric M-Cars won't come within the next 10-15 years, I guess.

[Pauleebe]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

I had the pleasure of driving a C Coupe for an extended period of time. That package is superior to the 4 series. BMW needs to step up their game. We're falling behind. I'm all for innovation, and moving forward. It just hurts to see cars like the AMG GT, and the Rebadged VW R8 halo cars, while BMW is putting out 'Special Edition' cars like the M6 Competition Edition or our Halo car, the i8. Our competitors are thriving with Twin Turbo V8's and naturally aspirated V10's.

I understand that times have changed, but we can't just rest on our laurels. It's a sad day when you start hearing a Mercedes is 'more fun' to drive than it's BMW counterpart.

I think you misunderstood me. My point is against the naysayers whining that BMW is considering electric engines in M cars, and has already moved to turbochargers.

So, I agree with you, especially in light of competition, they need to use whatever avenue possible to remain more innovative.

[Sterling Roadster]

Originally Posted by Outlaw 06

Synopsis: BMW’s M division used to lead the competition by producing iconic performance cars, but those days are long gone for M in particular and BMW in general. BMW will continue proliferating the market with predictable, M-badged, turbocharged products, while resting on the laurels and legacy of yesteryear’s iconic M cars. Finally, we will continue cashing in on our long-ago-earned reputation for as long as we possibly can.

Pretty much sums it up.

[Sterling Roadster]

If M-performance meant you could pick and choose the true mechanical performance parts you like such as LSD, Short Shifter, Bucket Seats etc. It would make sense. Unfortunately as of now it's mostly decals, cool shift knobs, Pedals and badges. The M Technik E36 was on the right path IMO.

[stealth.pilot]

Originally Posted by Outlaw 06

Synopsis: BMW’s M division used to lead the competition by producing iconic performance cars, but those days are long gone for M in particular and BMW in general. BMW will continue proliferating the market with predictable, M-badged, turbocharged products, while resting on the laurels and legacy of yesteryear’s iconic M cars. Finally, we will continue cashing in on our long-ago-earned reputation for as long as we possibly can.

Meanwhile the true M Fanatics have moved on to Porsche.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Law

You see, BMW's marketing has worked because this is exactly what they want people to think, that the current MPAs are some sort of offspring or descendants of the M535i, when it is far from the truth.

The M535i wasn't just a 5er with a sport package slapped with M-badges to help it sell better.
It was available only with a dogleg manual transmission and was equipped with a standard LSD from the factory (not "port install" or "dealer install").
Chassis and suspension components were modified/strengthened, shocks made by Bilstein, wheels by BBS, brake rotors had a thicker and vented construction, and Recaro seats were standard equipment.
Final assembly was finished by hand at the BMW Motorsport GmbH facility in Preussenstrasse.
Where it fell short of being a "full" Motorsport vehicle was that the motor was an M30 (BMW AG motor).
That all changed when they took the same formula above but stuck the M1's motor into the engine bay with the E28, spawning first M5.

Based on the above formula, neither the M235i or the X4 M40i, etc. are similar in philosophy or quality of construction.
The only thing they have in common is the "M" badge whilst not being full M-cars.
But understand that the M535i was developed by BMW Motorsport GmbH as a special vehicle, not as a segment filler designed to follow market trends.
That's the difference.

:

So much fail

[Law]

Originally Posted by miamiten

:

So much fail

Speak for yourself.

The M535i paved the way for the M5, not MPAs.

[Merlin_83]

Originally Posted by stealth.pilot

Meanwhile the true M Fanatics have moved on to Porsche.

Easy now, Porsche also has their full line of SUV's, four-door sedans, etc. that to some degree has diluted the heritage of classic Porsches the same way the M cars history has been overused in marketing at BMW.

Plus, most enthusiast want to drive manuals to be more 'in-control' of the car. And Porsche sells a lot more of the automatic PDK transmission, like the one in your 2014 Porsche. I know, I know the PDK is faster than a human, but it's still more fun to shift gears.

Cheers,
Merlin