What do you think of Tesla?

3.0L · 12-22-2015, 07:58 PM

As a day to day driver, the current Tesla isn't bad.

But before I will lay out 75 to 105 grand (before credits, incentives, and supposed gas savings, etc.), I'd like the range to be at least 350+ miles. 400 miles would be sweet. Currently, Tesla models are advertised somewhere around 240 miles to just under 300 miles of range. This is simply not practical for traveling, in my mind.

I'm about to go on a 365 mile trip, which my M235i or GLK350 can easily make on one tank of gas. The weather forecast is for rain and snow. I can't see myself stopping in bad weather for a long battery charge or expensive replacement.

The Tesla is a great car, but still has a ways to go before I will lay down that much money for a short range car.

https://my.teslamotors.com/models/de...ource=homepage

Rsquared71 · 12-22-2015, 08:28 PM

Cyberdemon, this was last week.
- Ok, I used "mandatory" as in he told me he had to stop for an hour to charge his car using a charging station along I95. He didn't say if it was the supercharging station or not.
- Yes, it's about 150 miles between cities. I'm not sure what circumstances lined up for him to need to recharge along the way. I do know that he did not get the top of the line battery, just the standard range.
- Wanting to save charge by relying on the dino juice car defeats the whole purpose, especially when he's paid a premium for the electric car.

Cyberdemon · 12-22-2015, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3.0L

I'm about to go on a 365 mile trip, which my M235i or GLK350 can easily make on one tank of gas.

Really? I've had my car for 10,000 miles and I've yet to get above 300 miles to a tank even when draining it to the last gallon.

I average about 260 miles of range of mostly highway driving (60 mile commute per day, 55 highway, 5 suburban roads) after the gas light comes on...maybe with Eco pro and slow highway driving in the coupe you could eek that out driving it down to the fumes.

Y0tsuya · 12-23-2015, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

I average about 260 miles of range of mostly highway driving (60 mile commute per day, 55 highway, 5 suburban roads) after the gas light comes on...maybe with Eco pro and slow highway driving in the coupe you could eek that out driving it down to the fumes.

I usually drive it down to 1/8 tank before fueling up. Odometer is usually > 300 by that point. My commute is 1/2 local and 1/2 highway and I'm averaging 26.5 mpg.

Stop-and-go traffic really eats away at the fuel economy so I avoid rush hour traffic when possible. I also avoid overzealous braking and coast a lot.

Nahlem · 12-23-2015, 04:17 AM

I Love electric cars for a reason and thats because they feel very fresh and new, My boss drives an BMW I3 and i have driven it quite a few times when doing some errands for him, He uses it for town driving mostly so the range is perfect for him his day starts at 05.00 in the morning and comes home around 17.00, For him the I3 is perfect to have around town and in his line of work visiting our work places around town. And driving other CEOs around town. (Note i live in Sweden so the culture of CEOs driving around in big fat suvs or other luxury cars doesn't exist here as in many other places) For example i work in a constructions company that is specialized in building environment friendly housing for people with low carbon foot printing and everything being A+++ classified in energy consuming, So if our CEO would drop in with a Ferrari or a Big as Suburban SUV he wouldn't be taken seriously at all. Specially if the company is focuses around environmental friendly house building.

He told me usually when his day is over he has about 20% battery left before charging it and every morning it is at 100% when he wakes up. But for longer trips for him and his wife they have a BMW 120d. Again our CEO isn't the typical CEO type.

So for me i can see what target BMW is aiming with the I3, For him its perfect instead of driving a diesel or a petrol car consuming that and letting out emissions. And it didn't cost any more then a top equipped car with a smaller engine would cost.

For example i drive a M235i just like a lot of people here on the forums our cars are both of the 2015 model class, Yet his i3 feels more modern then my M235i does.

And that is because its innovating in a new way, Petrol & Diesel engines sure they are nice but it is an old technique that hasn't changed for quite some time the engine still works the same way it did when it first was invited the in line engines. No matter how much new electronics you throw at them it is still the same and therefore no matter what car you drive with this type of engine it will still feel old. Even a Ferrari F458 Italia is still old in its essence when it comes down to how the engine works.

I love my car like crazy the feel and everything is awesome but i can't help feeling old (i am 28) when driving this car compared to when driving my bosses I3. And to be fair guys its 2015 should our cars really need to have emissions, Haven't we got the technique for developing engines that preforms awesome and doesn't let out any emissions in my opinion we do have but we are so slow to implement it.

So yes there is both pros and cons to both type of car's but it is great that there is people who buy these electric cars whether it be Tesla, BMW, Nissan or Ford it doesn't matter it brings money to developing electric cars with faster charging time and longer range. And that is really needed. Imagine in the future if all company cars like Vans, Bosses cars trucks and such stuff were driven with electric power or something like that. The effects would be great without effecting us privately those of us who wants to drive a Petrol or a Diesel car. Having options is the key!

Most companies who uses car are used in short range terms and a petrol or diesel might not be needed for the purpose thats why i hope more companies buy electric cars or cars with alternative fuels.

So yeah i am quite excited about Electric cars being developed and other alternative fuels, Both for the environment and innovation and at the same time. The more people that drives those cars with alternative fuels that isn't fossil the less punishment for those of us who still likes petrol cars. So i say keep up the phase with developing electric cars. The faster the better the lesser the punishment is for me who drives an Petrol car :-)

Zooks527 · 12-23-2015, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

.... the world should be thankful that we have somebody looking out for our interests once the dinosaur juice gets used up (which if you're my age, will happen in our lifetime).

Only if you believe the Gaia loons, or are planning to have a reaaaaallllyyy long lifetime. Those technology improvements that are assumed for batteries in the future have counterparts in oil recovery as well.

http://www.aei.org/publication/eia-r...f-oil-and-gas/

doccyber · 12-23-2015, 08:50 AM

Tesla needs a smaller and less expensive car to ever be on my list of cars to own. Even then I would lease one and never buy one as the reliability issues and being off warranty would be scary.

akuan99 · 12-23-2015, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

- but as battery technology improves, costs come down and the quality improves the world should be thankful that we have somebody looking out for our interests once the dinosaur juice gets used up (which if you're my age, will happen in our lifetime).

If you're old...then burn it all and let your grand kids worry about it.

Electricity for charging batteries does not come free.
Some of the resources used to generate electricity will eventually be depleted.
If Tesla really care about saving world resources they will start by building smaller vehicles that will require smaller batteries and less energy to charge them.

Cyberdemon · 12-23-2015, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akuan99

Electricity for charging batteries does not come free.
Some of the resources used to generate electricity will eventually be depleted.
If Tesla really care about saving world resources they will start by building smaller vehicles that will require smaller batteries and less energy to charge them.

Yeah, if only Tesla would invest in some way of getting energy, without digging it out of the ground.

Oh wait...

(Elon Musk is Chairman of Solar City if the irony got lost in that one)

And they are working on a smaller, less expensive car - but if you understand product development you realize the $700 iPhone had to come before the $49 Samsung whatever because the R&D and technology involve has massive upfront costs.

Saying that electric cars suck is like saying smartphones suck because the first iPhone couldn't run any other apps or receive MMS messages...it's simply a matter of time + investment + innovation.

akuan99 · 12-23-2015, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

Yeah, if only Tesla would invest in some way of getting energy, without digging it out of the ground.

Oh wait...

(Elon Musk is Chairman of Solar City if the irony got lost in that one)

And they are working on a smaller, less expensive car - but if you understand product development you realize the $700 iPhone had to come before the $49 Samsung whatever because the R&D and technology involve has massive upfront costs.

Saying that electric cars suck is like saying smartphones suck because the first iPhone couldn't run any other apps or receive MMS messages...it's simply a matter of time + investment + innovation.

Do you have number of percentage of solar energy being used for supplying electricity to charging stations?

I didn't say anything about electric car suck.
Finding inexpensive and efficient way to move 2 ton mass for several hundred miles is a significant more challenge that powering a smart phone.

MikeT · 12-23-2015, 10:42 AM

In a sense, I'm a perfect candidate for an electric car. I live ~3 miles from my office. I probably drive ~125 miles per week on average. The idea of not spending even a minute in a gas station is appealing to me.

On the other hand, there's not a single electric car on the market right now that I'd seriously consider owning (other than maybe an i8

).

Tesla S? It's huge. Gigantic. I like small cars, not only because they handle better and are more fun to drive, but also because I live in a city where big cars limit your parking choices.

i3? Sorry, can't get past its frumpy looks.

Nissan Leaf? See i3.

New Chevy Volt? Looks like an improvement over the first version, but 7 or 8 seconds 0-60? I just can't live like that.

If Tesla's Model 3 (or some other future vehicle) can deliver good looks, 0-60 in 5 seconds or below and decent range for a reasonable price, I'd definitely consider it.

One final point about range... I don't usually drive enough to need a long range, but for the occasional longer ride, I'd probably like to be able to do at least 150 miles without worrying about it. And I wouldn't want to have to drive like a very cautious old lady in order to achieve a decent range. As an experiment a couple months ago, I drove cautiously in eco pro mode for an entire tank. Sure, I improved my fuel economy and probably saved $10 over the course of a couple weeks, but I HATED it. Totally defeated the purpose of a car like the m235i, IMO. I wouldn't want to own any electric car that forced (or even encouraged) me to reduce my driving enjoyment or alter my driving style.

kdog26372 · 12-23-2015, 10:44 AM

Co-worker has a Tesla P85D; its very quick up to 60, seems to be just that initial thrust and then nothing terribly special in terms of acceleration after that. Design on outside looks kinda bland to me. Inside for what is an over $125k car optioned up it is considerably below that of other cars in that range Audi S8 and MB S550. Sure it's quicker to 60 than these cars (barely vs S8) and is electric if that's your thing (either a plus or minus depending on the consumer), but it certainly doesn't feel like a 6 figure car with fit/finish/interior appointments. The big screen? Big deal, its a larger iPad, probably costs $200 to make at most, probably less.

That said, I will look forward to their 3 series size vehicle that will be in the $35-$50k range. For that price, I think a lot of people will switch as the A4, 335/328, and MB C class are just ok inside as well and Tesla will most likely be quicker than those to 60 because electric, get similar range and have similar quality interior I'd think. Early rendering are hideous though, so hopefully that's not the reality, time will tell. More options the better though.

Cyberdemon · 12-23-2015, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kdog26372

Co-worker has a Tesla P85D; its very quick up to 60, seems to be just that initial thrust and then nothing terribly special in terms of acceleration after that.

The lack of noise and drama makes the speed deceptive - the P85D in insane mode is bonkers by any standard of the imagination.

If you don't care to watch the video, it's the P85D besting the 700hp Charger Hellcat in the quarter mile @ 11.6 seconds.

While the charger certainly starts to pull on it at the end there, at that point you're at Autobahn/salt flat speeds.

You're easily talking about a car that in any normal drag race would easily keep pace with the fastest germans out there, and with tax incentives starts below $100k which is right in M5 territory.

I would still rather have an M5 for all of the manly noises and grunts and heritage but for a 4 door Sedan (with two trunks) the Tesla makes a phenomenal grocery getter for the upper class.

kdog26372 · 12-23-2015, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

The lack of noise and drama makes the speed deceptive - the P85D in insane mode is bonkers by any standard of the imagination.

If you don't care to watch the video, it's the P85D besting the 700hp Charger Hellcat in the quarter mile @ 11.6 seconds.

While the charger certainly starts to pull on it at the end there, at that point you're at Autobahn/salt flat speeds.

You're easily talking about a car that in any normal drag race would easily keep pace with the fastest germans out there, and with tax incentives starts below $100k which is right in M5 territory.

I would still rather have an M5 for all of the manly noises and grunts and heritage but for a 4 door Sedan (with two trunks) the Tesla makes a phenomenal grocery getter for the upper class.

The Hellcats are way under-tired from the factory. Go to dragtimes and see slips of those with basic street drag radials. 10.8 in 1/4 and 126 mph 7 flat 1/8 mile at 100 mph vs Tesla Insane mode at 11.6 1/4 mile at 115 and 7.3 1/8 at 92 mph. Like I said it's all in the launch with the Tesla after that it dies off quickly compared to other high powered cars. Hell another forum member has his M235xi doing 1/4 in 11.6 at nearly 120 mph (JB4, DP, IC and racegas on stock all seasons) so about $1,500 in parts and $50k for the car it's on par with "insane" mode at all times same 1.6 60 foot and higher MPH in 1/4 means more up top.

Tesla is a great company and I own the stock in anticipation of them bringing an affordably priced vehicle to market in the next several years. I have personal experience driving in them on numerous occasions along with other high powered AWD cars and I don't feel that after the first 1-2 seconds of punch the car is all that fast and the MPH in the 1/4 validates what I'm feeling in the butt on the street.

Cyberdemon · 12-23-2015, 02:19 PM

Don't disagree with you, just suppose I'm glad we're living in a world where we can see a 11-second battery family sedan and go "meh".

3.0L · 12-23-2015, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

Really? I've had my car for 10,000 miles and I've yet to get above 300 miles to a tank even when draining it to the last gallon.

I average about 260 miles of range of mostly highway driving (60 mile commute per day, 55 highway, 5 suburban roads) after the gas light comes on...maybe with Eco pro and slow highway driving in the coupe you could eek that out driving it down to the fumes.

Yes, really.

And I'm talking about cruising on the interstate. My M235i consistantly pulls 32+ MPG and my GLK350 hovers right around 25 MPG. These are freeway numbers

wjjkoevoets · 12-23-2015, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3.0L

Yes, really.

And I'm talking about cruising on the interstate. My M235i consistantly pulls 32+ MPG and my GLK350 hovers right around 25 MPG. These are freeway numbers

It really depends on your driving style and the roads you're on. I went completely eco-pro on the car and my range indicator eventually said I could drive slightly over 400 miles on a full tank lol. But it really means you have to drive like a nanny in eco-pro mode on 50 mph roads. I've found 300 to 350 miles to be fairly realistic. If I play with the car in Sports mode I am usually limited to 260-270 miles.

3.0L · 12-23-2015, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wjjkoevoets

It really depends on your driving style and the roads you're on. I went completely eco-pro on the car and my range indicator eventually said I could drive slightly over 400 miles on a full tank lol. But it really means you have to drive like a nanny in eco-pro mode on 50 mph roads. I've found 300 to 350 miles to be fairly realistic. If I play with the car in Sports mode I am usually limited to 260-270 miles.

Well sure, driving style matters.

In the case of my M235i, I took it on the same trip a year and a half ago and recorded 32+ while in the Comfort Mode (I do not use ECO mode), with most of the trip on the interstate, cruising between 65 and 80 MPH.

On road trips, I accelerate smoothly, taking advantage of the torque; not full throttle screaming romps.

Merc for hire · 12-24-2015, 10:11 AM

I like Tesla, it's probably the only pure-electric car that doesn't look like a toy.
I won't drive one, but I respect those who do. Less gas consumption for everyone.

Roxy · 12-26-2015, 10:08 AM

Owned a Lotus Elise and scratched my head when the Roadster came out. It missed the point by being heavier and not quite as engaging. The pricing was also out-of-alignment, but it was a first in many ways and reimagined BEV as a sports car, not a greenmobile.

We all know that currently BEVs aren't saving the planet. They are paving the way for the development of infrastructure that could with the proper regulation.

As transportation though, the current concepts have drifted from Musk's original idea - the ultimate go-kart to the more salable gimongous sedan and CUVs. I think everyone understands why, though Musk has made noises about bringing back the Roadster.

Having driven a Tesla (not the P85D), I can say that my i3 BEV is significantly more fun - even with the high pressure no-grip tires and body roll. It's not Tesla's roadster or the Ludicrous mode sedan, but around town in traffic it's a blast. I owned a couple of 135s and was in the market for a 2 series and much to my own surprise got an i3.

No question, it's an urban second car for many, but it's fun and will hopefully become more fun with refreshes while BMW figures out how to differentiate it from the competition that is coming.

It's all about weight. Everyone knows power to weight defines more than acceleration (which the i3 has plenty of up to around town speeds). At 2600 lbs and change it's in line with the original Tesla Roadster (a little lighter actually). A lot more practical to boot. It changes direction like a BMW and is predictable and intuitive in similar ways. Sure driving style has to adjust, but it's still a RWD, balanced BMW. Try it, just for grins even!

Thus Musk's battery controller and soon battery tech is innovative, but didn't necessarily point us in all of the right directions. BMW's investment in carbon fiber is every bit as relevant.

I think Tesla is what Musk wanted it to be - a catalyst - just like SpaceX. We'll see if it makes money or if hydrogen becomes the real green solution.

Until then, check out the i3 as an alternative to the Hellcat threat of the P85. You'll never use all of that potential and it's expensive as all get-out and, in many ways, not as fun to drive every day --- in the city. I want to be clear about that. Range anxiety is real and the i3 requires attention. However, you can adjust and when you do, it's a lot of fun - more so than a Tesla (right now).

M2 + an i3 or Tesla P85? in a city. No brainer.

12-22-2015, 07:58 PM	#23
3.0L Colonel 8937 Rep 2,010 Posts Drives: M235i, 20k miles Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: California iTrader: (0)	As a day to day driver, the current Tesla isn't bad. But before I will lay out 75 to 105 grand (before credits, incentives, and supposed gas savings, etc.), I'd like the range to be at least 350+ miles. 400 miles would be sweet. Currently, Tesla models are advertised somewhere around 240 miles to just under 300 miles of range. This is simply not practical for traveling, in my mind. I'm about to go on a 365 mile trip, which my M235i or GLK350 can easily make on one tank of gas. The weather forecast is for rain and snow. I can't see myself stopping in bad weather for a long battery charge or expensive replacement. The Tesla is a great car, but still has a ways to go before I will lay down that much money for a short range car. https://my.teslamotors.com/models/de...ource=homepage __________________ ///M235i \| Mineral Grey Metallic \| Premium Package \| Technology Package \| Driver Assistance Package \| Dakota Coral Red/Black Leather \| Harman/Kardon Premium 360 watt sound system \| 8-speed automatic When writing your life's plan, use a pencil with an eraser
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-22-2015, 08:28 PM	#24
Rsquared71 New Member 1 Rep 25 Posts Drives: M235i xDrive Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Washington DC iTrader: (0)	Cyberdemon, this was last week. - Ok, I used "mandatory" as in he told me he had to stop for an hour to charge his car using a charging station along I95. He didn't say if it was the supercharging station or not. - Yes, it's about 150 miles between cities. I'm not sure what circumstances lined up for him to need to recharge along the way. I do know that he did not get the top of the line battery, just the standard range. - Wanting to save charge by relying on the dino juice car defeats the whole purpose, especially when he's paid a premium for the electric car.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-23-2015, 04:17 AM	#27
Nahlem Captain 1144 Rep 892 Posts Drives: None atm Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Sweden iTrader: (0) Garage List 2022 BMW i4 m50 [10.00]	I Love electric cars for a reason and thats because they feel very fresh and new, My boss drives an BMW I3 and i have driven it quite a few times when doing some errands for him, He uses it for town driving mostly so the range is perfect for him his day starts at 05.00 in the morning and comes home around 17.00, For him the I3 is perfect to have around town and in his line of work visiting our work places around town. And driving other CEOs around town. (Note i live in Sweden so the culture of CEOs driving around in big fat suvs or other luxury cars doesn't exist here as in many other places) For example i work in a constructions company that is specialized in building environment friendly housing for people with low carbon foot printing and everything being A+++ classified in energy consuming, So if our CEO would drop in with a Ferrari or a Big as Suburban SUV he wouldn't be taken seriously at all. Specially if the company is focuses around environmental friendly house building. He told me usually when his day is over he has about 20% battery left before charging it and every morning it is at 100% when he wakes up. But for longer trips for him and his wife they have a BMW 120d. Again our CEO isn't the typical CEO type. So for me i can see what target BMW is aiming with the I3, For him its perfect instead of driving a diesel or a petrol car consuming that and letting out emissions. And it didn't cost any more then a top equipped car with a smaller engine would cost. For example i drive a M235i just like a lot of people here on the forums our cars are both of the 2015 model class, Yet his i3 feels more modern then my M235i does. And that is because its innovating in a new way, Petrol & Diesel engines sure they are nice but it is an old technique that hasn't changed for quite some time the engine still works the same way it did when it first was invited the in line engines. No matter how much new electronics you throw at them it is still the same and therefore no matter what car you drive with this type of engine it will still feel old. Even a Ferrari F458 Italia is still old in its essence when it comes down to how the engine works. I love my car like crazy the feel and everything is awesome but i can't help feeling old (i am 28) when driving this car compared to when driving my bosses I3. And to be fair guys its 2015 should our cars really need to have emissions, Haven't we got the technique for developing engines that preforms awesome and doesn't let out any emissions in my opinion we do have but we are so slow to implement it. So yes there is both pros and cons to both type of car's but it is great that there is people who buy these electric cars whether it be Tesla, BMW, Nissan or Ford it doesn't matter it brings money to developing electric cars with faster charging time and longer range. And that is really needed. Imagine in the future if all company cars like Vans, Bosses cars trucks and such stuff were driven with electric power or something like that. The effects would be great without effecting us privately those of us who wants to drive a Petrol or a Diesel car. Having options is the key! Most companies who uses car are used in short range terms and a petrol or diesel might not be needed for the purpose thats why i hope more companies buy electric cars or cars with alternative fuels. So yeah i am quite excited about Electric cars being developed and other alternative fuels, Both for the environment and innovation and at the same time. The more people that drives those cars with alternative fuels that isn't fossil the less punishment for those of us who still likes petrol cars. So i say keep up the phase with developing electric cars. The faster the better the lesser the punishment is for me who drives an Petrol car :-) __________________ Current Car: Bicycle Former Car:BMW i4 M50 Brooklyn Grey (MY22)\| BMW i3s BEV (MY19)\|Former Car: BMW X1 20d x-drive (MY16)\|BMW m235i (MY14)\|Former Car: BMW 120d (MY12)\|Former Car: Volvo C30 T5 R-Design (MY08)\|Former Car: Volvo C70 T5 (MY06)\|Former Car: Volvo S40 2.0T(MY1999)
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-23-2015, 08:50 AM	#29
doccyber Captain 259 Rep 628 Posts Drives: %D0%97%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0 Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Los Angeles, CA iTrader: (0)	Tesla needs a smaller and less expensive car to ever be on my list of cars to own. Even then I would lease one and never buy one as the reliability issues and being off warranty would be scary.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-23-2015, 10:42 AM	#33
MikeT Lieutenant 170 Rep 533 Posts Drives: 2015 m235i Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: California iTrader: (0)	In a sense, I'm a perfect candidate for an electric car. I live ~3 miles from my office. I probably drive ~125 miles per week on average. The idea of not spending even a minute in a gas station is appealing to me. On the other hand, there's not a single electric car on the market right now that I'd seriously consider owning (other than maybe an i8 ). Tesla S? It's huge. Gigantic. I like small cars, not only because they handle better and are more fun to drive, but also because I live in a city where big cars limit your parking choices. i3? Sorry, can't get past its frumpy looks. Nissan Leaf? See i3. New Chevy Volt? Looks like an improvement over the first version, but 7 or 8 seconds 0-60? I just can't live like that. If Tesla's Model 3 (or some other future vehicle) can deliver good looks, 0-60 in 5 seconds or below and decent range for a reasonable price, I'd definitely consider it. One final point about range... I don't usually drive enough to need a long range, but for the occasional longer ride, I'd probably like to be able to do at least 150 miles without worrying about it. And I wouldn't want to have to drive like a very cautious old lady in order to achieve a decent range. As an experiment a couple months ago, I drove cautiously in eco pro mode for an entire tank. Sure, I improved my fuel economy and probably saved $10 over the course of a couple weeks, but I HATED it. Totally defeated the purpose of a car like the m235i, IMO. I wouldn't want to own any electric car that forced (or even encouraged) me to reduce my driving enjoyment or alter my driving style.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-23-2015, 10:44 AM	#34
kdog26372 Lieutenant 243 Rep 447 Posts Drives: 2015 M235xi BSM Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	Co-worker has a Tesla P85D; its very quick up to 60, seems to be just that initial thrust and then nothing terribly special in terms of acceleration after that. Design on outside looks kinda bland to me. Inside for what is an over $125k car optioned up it is considerably below that of other cars in that range Audi S8 and MB S550. Sure it's quicker to 60 than these cars (barely vs S8) and is electric if that's your thing (either a plus or minus depending on the consumer), but it certainly doesn't feel like a 6 figure car with fit/finish/interior appointments. The big screen? Big deal, its a larger iPad, probably costs $200 to make at most, probably less. That said, I will look forward to their 3 series size vehicle that will be in the $35-$50k range. For that price, I think a lot of people will switch as the A4, 335/328, and MB C class are just ok inside as well and Tesla will most likely be quicker than those to 60 because electric, get similar range and have similar quality interior I'd think. Early rendering are hideous though, so hopefully that's not the reality, time will tell. More options the better though. __________________ '15 M235xi \| BSM/Oyster/Aluminum \| Black Kidneys \| RW Carbon Mirror Caps \| 40% tint
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-23-2015, 02:19 PM	#37
Cyberdemon Brigadier General 1538 Rep 3,331 Posts Drives: 2020 X5 40i, 2018 M3 Comp Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Long Island NY iTrader: (3)	Don't disagree with you, just suppose I'm glad we're living in a world where we can see a 11-second battery family sedan and go "meh". __________________ Current: '20 X5, '18 M3 ZCP Previous: '11 E90 335i, '11 E90 M3, '16 VW GTI, '15 M235i, '13 335i, '08 TL-S, '00 Corvette
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-24-2015, 10:11 AM	#41
Merc for hire First Lieutenant 157 Rep 387 Posts Drives: M235i 6MT Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada iTrader: (0)	I like Tesla, it's probably the only pure-electric car that doesn't look like a toy. I won't drive one, but I respect those who do. Less gas consumption for everyone.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-26-2015, 10:08 AM	#42
Roxy New Member 2 Rep 5 Posts Drives: i3 BEV Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Albuquerque, NM iTrader: (0)	Musk had it right with the Roadster Owned a Lotus Elise and scratched my head when the Roadster came out. It missed the point by being heavier and not quite as engaging. The pricing was also out-of-alignment, but it was a first in many ways and reimagined BEV as a sports car, not a greenmobile. We all know that currently BEVs aren't saving the planet. They are paving the way for the development of infrastructure that could with the proper regulation. As transportation though, the current concepts have drifted from Musk's original idea - the ultimate go-kart to the more salable gimongous sedan and CUVs. I think everyone understands why, though Musk has made noises about bringing back the Roadster. Having driven a Tesla (not the P85D), I can say that my i3 BEV is significantly more fun - even with the high pressure no-grip tires and body roll. It's not Tesla's roadster or the Ludicrous mode sedan, but around town in traffic it's a blast. I owned a couple of 135s and was in the market for a 2 series and much to my own surprise got an i3. No question, it's an urban second car for many, but it's fun and will hopefully become more fun with refreshes while BMW figures out how to differentiate it from the competition that is coming. It's all about weight. Everyone knows power to weight defines more than acceleration (which the i3 has plenty of up to around town speeds). At 2600 lbs and change it's in line with the original Tesla Roadster (a little lighter actually). A lot more practical to boot. It changes direction like a BMW and is predictable and intuitive in similar ways. Sure driving style has to adjust, but it's still a RWD, balanced BMW. Try it, just for grins even! Thus Musk's battery controller and soon battery tech is innovative, but didn't necessarily point us in all of the right directions. BMW's investment in carbon fiber is every bit as relevant. I think Tesla is what Musk wanted it to be - a catalyst - just like SpaceX. We'll see if it makes money or if hydrogen becomes the real green solution. Until then, check out the i3 as an alternative to the Hellcat threat of the P85. You'll never use all of that potential and it's expensive as all get-out and, in many ways, not as fun to drive every day --- in the city. I want to be clear about that. Range anxiety is real and the i3 requires attention. However, you can adjust and when you do, it's a lot of fun - more so than a Tesla (right now). M2 + an i3 or Tesla P85? in a city. No brainer.
	Appreciate 0 Quote