New Ytest
Sign out
Bimmerpost
Login
BMW E39 5-Series Forum | 5Post.com
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read  
Go Back   BMW E39 5-Series Forum | 5Post.com > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General Automotive (non-BMW) Talk + Photos/Videos

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-25-2018, 05:23 PM   #1
Clark_Kent
Lieutenant Colonel
Clark_Kent's Avatar
2208
Rep
1,889
Posts

 
Drives: Retired
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA

iTrader: (0)

C&D: Our Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio at 10,000 Miles Has Spent a Month in the Shop

Disappointing to see this. I'm seeing nothing to distance Alfa Romeo from the reliability generalizations.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...ability-update
Appreciate 0
      09-25-2018, 07:47 PM   #2
D22M2
Captain
1367
Rep
788
Posts

 
Drives: Not a real M Car
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Dublin , CA

iTrader: (0)

One of the best sounding 6 cylinder engines around...almost as nice as the N55
Appreciate 2
      09-27-2018, 07:56 PM   #3
Dog Face Pony Soldier
2006 TIME Person Of The Year
Dog Face Pony Soldier's Avatar
United_States
9720
Rep
6,445
Posts

 
Drives: M Sport 335i
Join Date: May 2013
Location: North Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 335i  [9.74]
Paying for a Quadrifoglio, but driving a Chrysler 300 in between repeated visits to the dealer. That is a truly scary thought.
__________________
Appreciate 4
Poiseuille5362.00
rr006rbc1203.00
clee1982796.00
      09-27-2018, 08:03 PM   #4
minn19
Lieutenant General
minn19's Avatar
13970
Rep
10,061
Posts

 
Drives: 24 Z06, 23 CT4VBW, 22 PFinder
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Minnesota

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by glennQNYC View Post
Paying for a Quadrifoglio, but driving a Chrysler 300 in between repeated visits to the dealer. That is a truly scary thought.
Sadly it’s better than the base Fiesta/Focus I would get when my GT350 was laid up for months over a couple of summers. Not that base 320/328 are great that I’ve gotten from BMW, but much preferable to those other cars.
Appreciate 4
Poiseuille5362.00
Run Silent15127.00
JTO245246.50
      09-27-2018, 08:07 PM   #5
minn19
Lieutenant General
minn19's Avatar
13970
Rep
10,061
Posts

 
Drives: 24 Z06, 23 CT4VBW, 22 PFinder
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Minnesota

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
Disappointing to see this. I'm seeing nothing to distance Alfa Romeo from the reliability generalizations.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...ability-update
This plus no manual/inconsistent dealer experiences I read about were the biggest reasons I came back to BMW over a QV. I hope Alfa sticks around though and works out the bugs/establishes a long term confident presence in the US because I really really like my test drives in them. If they can get that stuff figured out a bit better I would like to give them a try someday or get my wife one. She really likes the look of them as do I inside and out.
Appreciate 1
      09-27-2018, 08:46 PM   #6
Tuxedo
Bowties r cool ▶:◀
Tuxedo's Avatar
United_States
1399
Rep
793
Posts

 
Drives: 09' 128i MT e88, 24'G05 X5 50e
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Chicago

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
multi new looking Alfa Romeo Stelvio's on other New Dealer used lots spotted earlier this week and was thinking someone already had enough worth taking a bath on a deal.
Appreciate 1
      09-27-2018, 09:00 PM   #7
Fender150
Lieutenant
United_States
354
Rep
464
Posts

 
Drives: F82 M4
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: PA

iTrader: (0)

Totally expected, if you live in countries that have a ton of italian cars, fiats, alfas and lancias you will know! Old or new, steer completely away lol!
Appreciate 1
Poiseuille5362.00
      09-27-2018, 09:20 PM   #8
Poiseuille
Brigadier General
Poiseuille's Avatar
United_States
5362
Rep
3,736
Posts

 
Drives: 2016 M4 DCT Tanzanite/Amaro
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Princeton

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
  [0.00]
  [10.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender150 View Post
Totally expected, if you live in countries that have a ton of italian cars, fiats, alfas and lancias you will know! Old or new, steer completely away lol!
lol, this reminded me of the famous Top Gear Burned-To-The-Ground-Lancia Photo Gallery
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2018, 04:24 AM   #9
10"
Colonel
10"'s Avatar
No_Country
4946
Rep
2,263
Posts

 
Drives: orange BMW 1M.
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: world

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aboen View Post
One of the best sounding 6 cylinder engines around...almost as nice as the N55
I really like the N55 and really enjoyed the sound of my 135is when I had it; but the Alfa engine is waaaaaaaaay better sounding. It sounds totally fierce in a way the N55 never can. A far superior engine to the N55.
__________________
don't read this. too late...
Appreciate 0
      09-28-2018, 10:19 AM   #10
saeyedoc
Captain
284
Rep
835
Posts

 
Drives: 2013 Carrera S, 2013 Panny GTS
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Antonio, TX

iTrader: (0)

Maybe they need a soundtrack on a USB stick so you can hear the Alfa's engine while you're driving the Chrysler 300.
Appreciate 3
wdb4673.00
AIRHEIR441.00
      09-28-2018, 10:28 AM   #11
Funf6cyl
Banned
275
Rep
526
Posts

 
Drives: 6 cyl
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Synchronized

iTrader: (0)

I have heard the Quads have been pretty reliable from many other owners and corraborated on the Giukia forums. Apparently they did make a fix for 2018 and you can get some great deals on them. IMO a far better car to drive than anything in the segment except maybe the C6:S coupe.
Appreciate 2
mcc3456332.00
clee1982796.00
      09-28-2018, 08:10 PM   #12
Dog Face Pony Soldier
2006 TIME Person Of The Year
Dog Face Pony Soldier's Avatar
United_States
9720
Rep
6,445
Posts

 
Drives: M Sport 335i
Join Date: May 2013
Location: North Jersey

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 335i  [9.74]
Read this headline and immediately envisioned Alfa dealers issuing minivan loaners.
Attached Images
 
__________________
Appreciate 2
shay2nak1070.00
      09-28-2018, 08:26 PM   #13
Germanauto
Major General
Germanauto's Avatar
United_States
9666
Rep
6,075
Posts

 
Drives: Alfa Romeo Giulia, Rosso
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: LA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuxedo View Post
multi new looking Alfa Romeo Stelvio's on other New Dealer used lots spotted earlier this week and was thinking someone already had enough worth taking a bath on a deal.
Stelvio is the cheapest looking vehicle out of the factory on sale today.
Appreciate 1
Viffermike1753.00
      09-29-2018, 02:09 AM   #14
positiveions
Lieutenant General
positiveions's Avatar
Lebanon
961
Rep
11,722
Posts

 
Drives: 19 Tacoma, 16 Golf wagon
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Upland, CA

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
That’s why I was in no rush buying one. Alfa’s are only good while they are under warranty.
Appreciate 0
      09-29-2018, 07:28 AM   #15
c1pher
Primo Generalissimo
c1pher's Avatar
United_States
4546
Rep
3,996
Posts

 
Drives: All of them
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: DC area

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
This plus no manual/inconsistent dealer experiences I read about were the biggest reasons I came back to BMW over a QV. I hope Alfa sticks around though and works out the bugs/establishes a long term confident presence in the US because I really really like my test drives in them. If they can get that stuff figured out a bit better I would like to give them a try someday or get my wife one. She really likes the look of them as do I inside and out.
I was really disappointed in Raleigh when they decided to essentially consolidate service with the Dodge/Ram dealer in the next lot. I had a Fiat Abarth that was being serviced by a Fiat/Alfa dealer and then without notice the next time I go in, I’m supposed to take me car to Dodge? I was really smitten by the 4c and was seriously considering buying until that event.
Appreciate 1
minn1913970.00
      09-30-2018, 04:15 AM   #16
eluded
2JZ-GTE
eluded's Avatar
Bulgaria
2959
Rep
3,948
Posts

 
Drives: 340 6MT, 50e, others
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Sofia

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by positiveions View Post
That’s why I was in no rush buying one. Alfa’s are only good while they are under warranty.
And even then it might be in the shop so you can't drive it. Alfas are extremely unreliable
Appreciate 0
      09-30-2018, 09:25 AM   #17
Poiseuille
Brigadier General
Poiseuille's Avatar
United_States
5362
Rep
3,736
Posts

 
Drives: 2016 M4 DCT Tanzanite/Amaro
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Princeton

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
  [0.00]
  [10.00]
just stunned to read these suggestions that mid-priced Italian hot-rods might be, errrrrr, less than reliable.....stunned I say!
Appreciate 0
      10-02-2018, 01:01 PM   #18
Viffermike
Colonel
Viffermike's Avatar
United_States
1753
Rep
2,942
Posts

 
Drives: '18 black-n-blue 718 Cayman
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Big D

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poiseuille View Post
just stunned to read these suggestions that mid-priced Italian hot-rods might be, errrrrr, less than reliable.....stunned I say!
I know, right?

Almost nothing mechanical and has four wheels that is made in Italy is reliable. This truism has applied for decades. Decades. The only real exceptions are some Italian motorcycles (Aprilias, mainly -- especially its scooters) and, IIRC, ItalKart go-karts.

Meanwhile, there's this ad-fueled clickbait drivel from Autobytel, which names the Giulia as the No. 1 most reliable European car in 2018. After laughing my way through that list, I vowed never to read (much less click through) another anything by that entity again.
__________________
--Life is a journey made more exciting with a fast car.--
--Helmets are for closers.--
<<Current: "Blackened" '18 NBM Porsche 718 Cayman ... Gone (but not forgotten): "Blackened" MG '15 228i M Sport w/aFe filter/scoop, Hertz drivers, P3Cars multigauge, other goodies>>
Appreciate 1
Poiseuille5362.00
      10-02-2018, 01:41 PM   #19
BEM-S4
Major General
BEM-S4's Avatar
United_States
4515
Rep
8,942
Posts

 
Drives: Dinan M235, Dinan Sport Wagon
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Philadelphia

iTrader: (5)

One of my lawyers has a Guila - he was bitching about it being in the shop all the time. It is a first year model. I told him in all seriousness if he thought his Italian chariot would be anything but trouble I needed to seriously reevaluate heeding his counsel. Alfisti take a perverse pleasure in the challenges of ownership. I quoted Tom Hanks in Major League to him "the hard is what makes it great, if it were easy everyone would do it."

End of the day he's not an Alfisti, not a bad thing just is what it is. For those who love them no mechanical issues will matter, for those who don't love them they never will.
__________________
2022 Macan S
2016 F31 328i xDrive Sport Wagon
2006 E46 330ci ZHP Convertible
Appreciate 3
Viffermike1753.00
Poiseuille5362.00
minn1913970.00
      10-02-2018, 03:21 PM   #20
Run Silent
Run Deep
Run Silent's Avatar
United_States
15127
Rep
4,123
Posts

 
Drives: Back and Forth To Work
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: The Mountains

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
As much as I have a special place in my heart for Alfa, I know better than to attempt to own one again. Back in the late 90's, I purchased a mint one-owner 1986 Alfa Spider Quadrifoglio with about 20k miles on her.

I absolutely loved everything about that car......when it wasn't trying to kill me.

In the span of 18 months and about 10k miles, it broke down on me three times. Note I didn't say it broke, I said it broke down. I have owned close to 30 cars in my lifetime, and this was the only car I ever had that actually broke down, before or since. When things went wrong, it wasn't that a window wouldn't roll up, or the A/C would stop working - those I could have handled. Things would break that would leave me stranded and just like in the article, Alfa had such horrible parts support that inevitably the part needed wouldn't be in stock anywhere in the USA, so there the car would sit - for weeks on end.

I still miss that car, and sometimes entertain the idea of clicking 'bid' on BAT for some of the nicer ones, or consider looking at a nearly new Giulia - but then my brain kicks me and reminds me of what is to come.

FWIW - my father worked as a senior service director for the largest Alfa dealer in the southeast back in the 80's. He was sent over as part of a delegation to Italy to help offer insight as to why quality control was so bad. He summed it up in this story:

Dad: "Why is the leather coming apart on the seats before the cars even arrive to the showroom?"
Luigi: "Is notta my fault, it is a Mario's fault"
Mario: "Isa not my fault, isa Luigi's fault"
Dad: "Well, you are using the correct leather supplier, right?"
Mario: "No no, sir, I founda much better quality leather supplier, isa my cousin. He get better quality, I use him instead."

End result? Graft and refusing to take blame for anything was the primary cause of quality failures. No surprise, really. Seems it has yet to be solved.
Appreciate 6
Poiseuille5362.00
GORDON.M31403.00
minn1913970.00
FaRKle!3996.00
clee1982796.00
      10-02-2018, 03:40 PM   #21
Viffermike
Colonel
Viffermike's Avatar
United_States
1753
Rep
2,942
Posts

 
Drives: '18 black-n-blue 718 Cayman
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Big D

iTrader: (0)

There are just some things the Italians do horribly, and other things the Italians do really, really well.

It's largely cultural: How manufacturing is defined and approached, how business is accomplished, how its citizens accept homegrown products into daily life. Italy has been, in many ways, a mess since World War Two because it culturally can't reconcile many fundamental differences between old-world and new-world economies of scale. Part of this is political. But a ton of it is cultural, especially relating to the value of the available skills of the labor force.

Simply put, no Western country places more value on skilled laborers than Italy does. The problem is that those skills are often not valued outside of the culture -- and when they are, it's at such a rarefied level -- fashion, textiles, and winemaking are three great examples -- that it's not translatable on a large-enough scale to matter to the economy as a whole. Another problem is that economic leadership frequently comes from leaders in these skilled fields. That does little to nothing to help the country progress.

There are entities that have overcome this bias in Italy -- Luxottica (eyewear), Mark Bass (pro music equipment), Aprilia (motorbikes), and Fiat-Chrysler to an extent -- but even that latter example has 'special' qualities that are very, well, Italian. The country is at a major crossroads with this issue because the EU has exposed (and covered for) many of those weaknesses, and the country is increasingly anti-immigration while basically refusing to attempt to convert its active and emerging labor forces. Until some of it shifts, Italian manufacturing quality -- whether in-country or outside of it -- won't improve overall.
__________________
--Life is a journey made more exciting with a fast car.--
--Helmets are for closers.--
<<Current: "Blackened" '18 NBM Porsche 718 Cayman ... Gone (but not forgotten): "Blackened" MG '15 228i M Sport w/aFe filter/scoop, Hertz drivers, P3Cars multigauge, other goodies>>
Appreciate 2
Poiseuille5362.00
minn1913970.00
      10-02-2018, 06:41 PM   #22
Poiseuille
Brigadier General
Poiseuille's Avatar
United_States
5362
Rep
3,736
Posts

 
Drives: 2016 M4 DCT Tanzanite/Amaro
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Princeton

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
  [0.00]
  [10.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viffermike View Post
There are just some things the Italians do horribly, and other things the Italians do really, really well.

It's largely cultural: How manufacturing is defined and approached, how business is accomplished, how its citizens accept homegrown products into daily life. Italy has been, in many ways, a mess since World War Two because it culturally can't reconcile many fundamental differences between old-world and new-world economies of scale. Part of this is political. But a ton of it is cultural, especially relating to the value of the available skills of the labor force.

Simply put, no Western country places more value on skilled laborers than Italy does. The problem is that those skills are often not valued outside of the culture -- and when they are, it's at such a rarefied level -- fashion, textiles, and winemaking are three great examples -- that it's not translatable on a large-enough scale to matter to the economy as a whole. Another problem is that economic leadership frequently comes from leaders in these skilled fields. That does little to nothing to help the country progress.

There are entities that have overcome this bias in Italy -- Luxottica (eyewear), Mark Bass (pro music equipment), Aprilia (motorbikes), and Fiat-Chrysler to an extent -- but even that latter example has 'special' qualities that are very, well, Italian. The country is at a major crossroads with this issue because the EU has exposed (and covered for) many of those weaknesses, and the country is increasingly anti-immigration while basically refusing to attempt to convert its active and emerging labor forces. Until some of it shifts, Italian manufacturing quality -- whether in-country or outside of it -- won't improve overall.
but such race cars they made.....
One of my favorite automobile museums is the Alfa factory museum outside Milan. My avatar is a picture taken there. Take a close look at the car pictured below. You can see that it has two parallel twin cam sixes. Inside the cockpit you can see that it has two separate transmissions. Only one transmission has a shift lever, and that lever is connected by a long bar to the other transmission where it's shifter normally would be. Now here it comes: it has two drive shafts and two diffs! Imagine backing that thing out of the garage! I must have taken a hundred pictures in that museum......
Attached Images
  
Appreciate 4
minn1913970.00
Red Bread4462.00
Viffermike1753.00
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:09 PM.




5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST