Cadillac CTS-V Priced from $84k USD

[ShocknAwe]

How do you explain the difference in the feel of the interior in say, the Chevy Malibu compared to the BMW 5er, Merc E, Audi A6? Or was I imagining that when I spent 2 months driving it while waiting for my car to be repaired. My in-laws have a new absolutely decked out Buick Enclave which is supposed to be a very luxurious SUV. It's a giant rolling prissed-up plasticky rattlebox.

Stop blowing smoke up everyone's ass saying that there's no difference in quality.

That being said, I'd love to be surprised when I go check it out. The fact that GM owns both Buick and Cadillac (along with Chevy and others) says I won't though.

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by fecurtis

That and just the overall layout and what you prefer is 100% subjective.

I like the relative minimalist layout of BMW interiors, always have. Others hate it since they think it looks dull or plain. A lot of people have been hating on Caddie interiors though, not just on here but in general and the CUE system is pretty much universally hated (much like iDrive was in it's early days).

Is CUE hated because it's the popular opinion in the media?

I don't have any issues with CUE in my dads ATS. I know how to use it, what to do is logical in my opinion, etc. Is it perfect? No, the zooming function( whether pinch to zoom or taping on the zoom in/out button) in the navigation is a bit slow, but the rest of the system is responsive with little lag.

There is a learning curve, but once you get use to it CUE isn't a huge negative as the media portrays it to be.

I also think people let their biases get in the way of assessing an interior. Whether it is because Cadillac isn't BMW so they bash the interior just because of their fanboyism or say the interior is crap( materials included) because the design is not to their tastes. Or you have Shocknawe who nitpicks every single small detail to death......

[ShocknAwe]

Originally Posted by quagmire

Or you have Shocknawe who nitpicks every single small detail to death......

It's all foreplay.

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by quagmire

Is CUE hated because it's the popular opinion in the media?

I don't have any issues with CUE in my dads ATS. I know how to use it, what to do is logical in my opinion, etc. Is it perfect? No, the zooming function( whether pinch to zoom or taping on the zoom in/out button) in the navigation is a bit slow, but the rest of the system is responsive with little lag.

There is a learning curve, but once you get use to it CUE isn't a huge negative as the media portrays it to be.

I also think people let their biases get in the way of assessing an interior. Whether it is because Cadillac isn't BMW so they bash the interior just because of their fanboyism or say the interior is crap( materials included) because the design is not to their tastes. Or you have Shocknawe who nitpicks every single small detail to death......

I hate it because the screen become littered in fingerprints, it's slow at times, and I just don't like touchscreens. I briefly used it a year ago at the DC Auto Show. I also don't like how there's no actual buttons on the center stack but it's all touch sensitive. I'd prefer a knob to control temperature instead of having to slide my fingers...plus that entire surface is a glossy black...so all of that gets fingerprints all over it too.

I've got no doubt it'll get better over time though.

[rubber_ducky]

Originally Posted by ShocknAwe

How do you explain the difference in the feel of the interior in say, the Chevy Malibu compared to the BMW 5er, Merc E, Audi A6? Or was I imagining that when I spent 2 months driving it while waiting for my car to be repaired. My in-laws have a new absolutely decked out Buick Enclave which is supposed to be a very luxurious SUV. It's a giant rolling prissed-up plasticky rattlebox.

Stop blowing smoke up everyone's ass saying that there's no difference in quality.

That being said, I'd love to be surprised when I go check it out. The fact that GM owns both Buick and Cadillac (along with Chevy and others) says I won't though.

In regards to your Malibu rental, I think you're confusing fit & finish and plastic quality. I have strong doubts that the CTS and ATS cars borrow any plastic parts from your former rental. But it's entirely possible that the plastic composite used is the same across the brands. But you knew that already.

Also... Buick aren't the only ones who let a rattlebox roll off of the assembly line: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1031768

[ShocknAwe]

Originally Posted by rubber_ducky

In regards to your Malibu rental, I think you're confusing fit & finish and plastic quality. I have strong doubts that the CTS and ATS cars borrow any plastic parts from your former rental. But it's entirely possible that the plastic composite used is the same across the brands. But you knew that already.

Also... Buick aren't the only ones who let a rattlebox roll off of the assembly line: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1031768

I believe you're splitting hairs at this point.

No my example was not a specific comparison. Obviously the CTS/ATS won't have the same parts, they will be however likely made by the same company whose production standards have been historically dubious. Yes, I knew that already. Yes, every brand does it.

[buildbright]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I took three plastics manufacturing courses in college, and manuafactured plastic parts early in my career, so I know a bit about plastics. I've been in both modern BMWs and Cadillacs (ATS and CTS), there's really no decernable difference in the quality of materials used. It's a matter of styling preference. As someone said earlier, when a American car matches or beats a BMW in performance, it turns to the "quality" of the interior.

I have not seen the molding process for both brands or read the MSDS sheets but I can tell you the support of the plastic (foam and clip adjustments) and how its molded makes a big difference. The finish design also makes a difference. Glossy black is a magnet for scratches. My dads XTS is already showing signs of the plastics not being finished and supported properly. The dealer told him its a GM thing and that's why its cheaper then a other brands.

GM interiors have been known as one the worst out there for being on the cheaper side but you have to remember its a mass market brand. I own a GMC Sierra and I laugh all the time I find hollow plastics and poor support for trim pieces.

[DieGrüneHölle]

I remember the early days of iDrive, it was hated by the media. Every single BMW review the model got knocked points for the iDrive. It took BMW years to get it right.

Comparing Cadillac interiors to a Malibu is kinda silly. It is like saying Lexus interiors really blow, because the Camry uses the same molds, foam, and clips. My Camry rental ealier in the year was an utter sh*tbox inside, but I wouldn't use it as a barometer for Lexus interiors.

[Ezio]

My problem with the interior is the focus on touch screen.

[MCarsFan]

Originally Posted by Ezio

My problem with the interior is the focus on touch screen.

Fingerprints all over a touchscreen are not cool. I agree. Look forward to driving it and being able to make an educated opinion. All I know is the car sounds like it's being redeveloped and improved with each iteration and that's great.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by MCarsFan

Fingerprints all over a touchscreen are not cool. I agree. Look forward to driving it and being able to make an educated opinion. All I know is the car sounds like it's being redeveloped and improved with each iteration and that's great.

Or the fact when it's freezing out side the touch screen also lags. My friend with a cts can tell you how much he hates it.

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by Ezio

Or the fact when it's freezing out side the touch screen also lags. My friend with a cts can tell you how much he hates it.

Yeah my Infiniti was touchscreen and the lag when it was cold out was frustrating. I appreciated the overall ease of use of the system but HATED the fingerprints.

[Efthreeoh]

What I find funny is the Tesla S has the biggest touch screen in the business and hardly any buttons on the dash at all, but I've never read any complaint about finger prints, or use of a touch screen, blah -blah. The Tesla's screen looks totally out of place in the dash; it's a big rectangle place on an otherwise angular design.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by fecurtis

That and just the overall layout and what you prefer is 100% subjective.

I like the relative minimalist layout of BMW interiors, always have. Others hate it since they think it looks dull or plain. A lot of people have been hating on Caddie interiors though, not just on here but in general and the CUE system is pretty much universally hated (much like iDrive was in it's early days).

Me too. I ordered my 325i without iDrive. I ended up getting a '08 Z4 (over a new ATS) with one of the reasons being no screen on the dash. CUE, i-drive, et.al. all are pointless to me.

[CirrusSR22]

Seems like a lot of people don't know you can buy an ATS without CUE. No main touchscreen and real knobs.

[Red Bread]

Except all of the "buttons" are touch sensitive with haptic feedback. It's still not a nice setup. The engines and transmissions of the non V ATS are what keep me away. The chassis is easily better than the F30, but the rest is a let down.

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by fecurtis

That and just the overall layout and what you prefer is 100% subjective.

I like the relative minimalist layout of BMW interiors, always have. Others hate it since they think it looks dull or plain. A lot of people have been hating on Caddie interiors though, not just on here but in general and the CUE system is pretty much universally hated (much like iDrive was in it's early days).

Me too, and that was in the time of E9X/E6X. Current interiors are not minimalist. Maybe before in concept form, but not in production form.

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

What I find funny is the Tesla S has the biggest touch screen in the business and hardly any buttons on the dash at all, but I've never read any complaint about finger prints, or use of a touch screen, blah -blah. The Tesla's screen looks totally out of place in the dash; it's a big rectangle place on an otherwise angular design.

I find it funny too. It remind when the iPhone and iPad came out and that was one of the criticisms of those products.

When the iPhone came out? OMG fingerprints!

When the iPad came out? OMG fingerprints!

Have those issues stuck? Nope mostly everyone now has a iPhone/Android phone with a touchscreen or a touchscreen tablet.

[DocWeatherington]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

In 2006 I couldn't deal with the engine not having a dipstick, but I had to over look it to consider buying my car. It's not like the Cady's interiors lack function. All interiors are different, it doesn't mean the car is worthless of consideration. If the interior hindered driving the car fast and not getting enjoyment out of the drive, then maybe that's an issue. But having spent considerable time and excellent road running behind the wheel of an ATS, I can attest the interior does not take away from the driving experience.

I agree.. I haven't sat in the ATS.. Just the new CTS V-Sport and the last Gen CTS-V...

Again both great cars from a dynamic point, just from the interior the last gen CTS was bad . The current is better, but still not my liking. CUE is a deal breaker, I can look past some of the design. I like Ford over GM for SUVs/Trucks.. But man do I hate the last gen Sync.

[DocWeatherington]

Originally Posted by buildbright

Agreed the interior is horrible IMO. To me the interior is very important because I don't drive on the outside of a car. Its plain and simple these cars have to excite you. If you just wanted raw performance we would buy older race prepped cars. A sports car these days isn't like before we want our and eat it two. Luckily these days we can.

I don't think we are the only ones that feel this way. I tend to believe the ATS-V sales wont come close to the M3/M4 or C63 AMG. Heck I bet Lexus sells more RCF's.

I agree, Sales probably won't be. But it has to start somewhere for Cadillac to get in the game.

Just wait for Lincoln to start getting back into this segment.. lol .. Town Car what....

[DocWeatherington]

Originally Posted by CirrusSR22

Seems like a lot of people don't know you can buy an ATS without CUE. No main touchscreen and real knobs.

I didn't know that.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by CirrusSR22

Seems like a lot of people don't know you can buy an ATS without CUE. No main touchscreen and real knobs.

While true, good luck in finding one without CUE on a dealer's lot. Worst off, you can't get Nav with CUE unless you get the Luxury or above level trim, which is for the ATS about a $6K price increase over the base trim. So what you find at dealers are Standard trim ATS with $1,435 CUE system option, which gives you a big screen in the dash and a better stereo and no option whatsoever to get Nav. So you get just a big screen that shows radio stations.

So last year I went to buy an ATS starting in July. I drive a lot so I wanted to keep the price low as possible but get a nice driving car. I wanted a black on black standard trim with a sun roof and a manual trans, which is basically what my E90 is now. Couldn't find one anywhere. I could have ordered one but the dealer offered no discount if I did, which meant I could get a higher level car (with an automatic of course) off the lot for a lower price - stupid. I looked every day for months hoping a car that I wanted would pop up. My local dealer finally got a Performance trim car in with a manual trans to test drive. I loved the car, but it was $46K, far above what I want to spend on a car I am going to drive 34,000 miles a year. So after months, I found 4 cars, one in New Jersey (it was a test drive mule with 500 miles on it), a second in Texas (I'd have to go get it), a third in Connecticut (I'd have to go get it) and one in Maryland, but it had no sunroof. My local dealer in Chantilly VA was a total dick and wouldn't bring in any of the cars I wanted unless I bought it at MSRP.

So I ended up keeping my E90 (now at 281,000 miles) and found a 23,000-mile E86 Z4 Coupe.