Carlos Sainz future - UPDATE: Williams

[G30M]

Helmut Marko has leaked that red bull has offered Carlos less money and it's now up to Carlos

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/104729...r-carlos-sainz

Meanwhile Carlos says he's not in a rush to decide.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by G30M

Helmut Marko has leaked that red bull has offered Carlos less money and it's now up to Carlos

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/104729...r-carlos-sainz

Meanwhile Carlos says he's not in a rush to decide.

Checo will get his 2025 Red Bull contract . So (hopefully)! Sainz can get LEW's Merc seat .
It's still not sure (IF)! Toto Wolff is interested to get Sainz at Mercedes.
Otherwise Sainz won't get a seat in 2025 and Audi is for 2026

Shame on you Ferrari !

[M5Rick]

^ Shocking how the 'secret syndicate' in the Maranello back rooms treat Carlo, as Fred puts on a brave face, I suspect '25 will be another disaster for Ferrari and Fred will be easily blamed and turfed out while the real culprits who decide remain anonymous.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

^ Shocking how the 'secret syndicate' in the Maranello back rooms treat Carlo, as Fred puts on a brave face, I suspect '25 will be another disaster for Ferrari and Fred will be easily blamed and turfed out while the real culprits who decide remain anonymous.

sounds like the Godfather (aka Mafia)

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Checo will get his 2025 Red Bull contract . So (hopefully)! Sainz can get LEW's Merc seat .
It's still not sure (IF)! Toto Wolff is interested to get Sainz at Mercedes.
Otherwise Sainz won't get a seat in 2025 and Audi is for 2026

Shame on you Ferrari !

Talking about kingmakers: Verstappen gets the 'right of first refusal' for the vacated Mercedes seat. Mercedes-AMG Petronas F1, the Mercedes-Benz Group and INEOS are eager to get him and got the financial ressources to meet Verstappen's demands for a shock move. With the Verstappens being disgruntled about Horner and as Newey has made up his mind to leave RBR because of Horner, there is momentum that was unfathomable in 2021 - for all involved on both sides, this is their brief 'window of opportunity' to strike.

Could also be that, as variant, with the RB20/RB21 in 2025 still best adapted to the current regs & rules, Verstappen commits to start racing for Mercedes from 2026 onwards (instead of from next season onwards). But it seems more likely that he will be donning the Mercedes track suit already in 2025 (as well as a 1971 24 Hours of Le Mans winner who set a 5000 km distance record, with a Dutch team mate, in a Porsche 917, that would stand for 39 years).

Sainz is just one of the (way cheaper) spare wheels of Wolff & C°. Kimi Antonelli got better talent cards and Merc time upon his sleeve for a long-term future at Mercedes, than Sainz. But Kimi is still 17 and will likely get prepared for a year or so at another team sporting a Merc engine. Carlos is 29.

If Sainz would get the available Merc seat, it will be for 2025 only and merely because Verstappen would have opted out for 2025. Sainz was very close to signing, but a supervening event abruptly stalled that plan: almost certainly that event was the Verstappens approaching Wolff with an 'invitation to treat'.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Talking about kingmakers: Verstappen gets the 'right of first refusal' for the vacated Mercedes seat. Mercedes-AMG Petronas F1, the Mercedes-Benz Group and INEOS are eager to get him and got the financial ressources to meet Verstappen's demands for a shock move. With the Verstappens being disgruntled about Horner and as Newey has made up his mind to leave RBR because of Horner, there is momentum that was unfathomable in 2021 - for all involved on both sides, this is their brief 'window of opportunity' to strike.

Could also be that, as variant, with the RB20/RB21 in 2025 still best adapted to the current regs & rules, Verstappen commits to start racing for Mercedes from 2026 onwards (instead of from next season onwards). But it seems more likely that he will be donning the Mercedes track suit already in 2025 (as well as a 1971 24 Hours of Le Mans winner who set a 5000 km distance record, with a Dutch team mate, in a Porsche 917, that would stand for 39 years).

Sainz is just one of the (way cheaper) spare wheels of Wolff & C°. Kimi Antonelli got better talent cards and Merc time upon his sleeve for a long-term future at Mercedes, than Sainz. But Kimi is still 17 and will likely get prepared for a year or so at another team sporting a Merc engine. Carlos is 29.

If Sainz would get the available Merc seat, it will be for 2025 only and merely because Verstappen would have opted out for 2025. Sainz was very close to signing, but a supervening event abruptly stalled that plan: almost certainly that event was the Verstappens approaching Wolff with an 'invitation to treat'.

As I said : The real issue at Red Bull is 'not the Horner sex-soap .
It's all about Horners Ford PU and his decission to say goodby to HONDA..
Meanwhile It's already an open book how strong the 2026 Mercedes monster PU will be and the 2026 Honda PU is already running and shows incredible strenght and reliability , not only the Honda combustion engine but also the electric motors and batteries by the 50:50 power split in 2026.
(according to Koji Watanabe)

At this moment , Honers Ford PU runs down in terms of power , and there is no guarantee that MAX can get a strong and reliable PU in 2026.
That makes the atmosphere at the Red Bull Team extremely nervous ...
All this is Horners fault by his wrong decision to build his own RB Ford PU (Red Bull Ford Powertrains)
That's why I said : 'Never split a winning combination !
As we know the winning combination was to run with a HONDA PU .
According to Horner : Everything goes like it was plannned..
Horner will be put under even more pressure by his own big mistake to part ways with HONDA.
The Red Bull Team can fall completely appart by Horners wrong decision..
And Newey's 2026 super-active-aero package would be worth nothing if the Ford PU runs down in power !

Currently it looks like Horner destroyed his own Red Bull Team !
Of course It's not 2026 yet , but 2 strong 2026 PU's like Mercedes and Honda are having a big power advantage.
The tide can turn , but the clock is ticking for Horner and his Ford PU !

[HeelToeShift]

I don't think Sai will go to RB. He isnt any better a driver than Per (similar style) and wouldn't produce any better results. I don't understand why everyone rates him so highly because 2 of his 3 career wins have been in races that Max would have otherwise won if not for the setup in Singapore and the DNF in Aus. Beyond that, despite Lec not having won a race last year, still beat Sai on overall points and we all know he is the faster driver, though not as consistent.
I imagine Sai ends up with a MB seat or he goes to Audi and drives for a few more years but never really achieves much more.
I'd actually like to see him go to RB and have Max destroy him again just to shut up everyone who thinks he's actually deserving and would mount a challenge.

[NYG]

I think the only place Sainz will be willing to take a 1 year contract at a lower price is Red Bull but he has to consider the fact that in the best case scenario where Ferrari and McLaren start to screw up their development at some point this year, he can only achieve P2 in the drivers championship. There's no way Sainz thinks he can beat Max. RB will end up with Lawson at some point I think.

I don't see Sainz taking a 1 year at Mercedes. He's going to drop his stock value for a team that won't be competitive.

Audi will be his best financial move, most likely.

If Ferrari and McLaren keep improving, next years constructors will not be so easy for RB. Both of those teams are stacked with talent and without throwing any shade at Checo because he is a good driver, he's just not as good as Lec, Ham, Nor, Pia

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by NYG

I think the only place Sainz will be willing to take a 1 year contract at a lower price is Red Bull but he has to consider the fact that in the best case scenario where Ferrari and McLaren start to screw up their development at some point this year, he can only achieve P2 in the drivers championship. There's no way Sainz thinks he can beat Max. RB will end up with Lawson at some point I think.

I don't see Sainz taking a 1 year at Mercedes. He's going to drop his stock value for a team that won't be competitive.

Audi will be his best financial move, most likely.

If Ferrari and McLaren keep improving, next years constructors will not be so easy for RB. Both of those teams are stacked with talent and without throwing any shade at Checo because he is a good driver, he's just not as good as Lec, Ham, Nor, Pia

I agree with you. I dont think Ferrari will develop that well...I expect that their basic and simple architecture was a good base but I have a feeling they are going to end up not understanding how to get more out of the car and likely end up with a smaller window and as they try to add performance will go back to eating tires. Mclaren will be wishy washy as they always are and I do expect MB to develop a bit as despite how bad Ham is driving, Rus seems to be getting a lot from it. He was neck and neck with Fer last race.
I think RB set themselves up for a higher ceiling in the RB20 while everyone else is working to what the peak of the RB19 was and will not be able to keep up as RB adds upgrades and certainly when 2025 is essentially the same cars.
I also hope they push back the 2026 regs for 1 or 2 more years.

Per is driving as well as he ever has - let's also not forget how many times Ham has struggled to get past Per. I think his mindset has done wonders for him knowing he can't beat Max but should strive for #2.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I agree with you. I dont think Ferrari will develop that well...I expect that their basic and simple architecture was a good base but I have a feeling they are going to end up not understanding how to get more out of the car and likely end up with a smaller window and as they try to add performance will go back to eating tires. Mclaren will be wishy washy as they always are and I do expect MB to develop a bit as despite how bad Ham is driving, Rus seems to be getting a lot from it. He was neck and neck with Fer last race.
I think RB set themselves up for a higher ceiling in the RB20 while everyone else is working to what the peak of the RB19 was and will not be able to keep up as RB adds upgrades and certainly when 2025 is essentially the same cars.
I also hope they push back the 2026 regs for 1 or 2 more years.

Something feels different about Ferrari - I think they might get it together. I definitely think they're more likely to be the one to compete for championships than McLaren right now.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

As I said : The real issue at Red Bull is 'not the Horner sex-soap .
It's all about Horners Ford PU and his decission to say goodby to HONDA..
Meanwhile It's already an open book how strong the 2026 Mercedes monster PU will be and the 2026 Honda PU is already running and shows incredible strenght and reliability , not only the Honda combustion engine but also the electric motors and batteries by the 50:50 power split in 2026.
(according to Koji Watanabe)

At this moment , Honers Ford PU runs down in terms of power , and there is no guarantee that MAX can get a strong and reliable PU in 2026.
That makes the atmosphere at the Red Bull Team extremely nervous ...
All this is Horners fault by his wrong decision to build his own RB Ford PU (Red Bull Ford Powertrains)
That's why I said : 'Never split a winning combination !
As we know the winning combination was to run with a HONDA PU .
According to Horner : Everything goes like it was plannned..
Horner will be put under even more pressure by his own big mistake to part ways with HONDA.
The Red Bull Team can fall completely appart by Horners wrong decision..
And Newey's 2026 super-active-aero package would be worth nothing if the Ford PU runs down in power !

Currently it looks like Horner destroyed his own Red Bull Team !
Of course It's not 2026 yet , but 2 strong 2026 PU's like Mercedes and Honda are having a big power advantage.
The tide can turn , but the clock is ticking for Horner and his Ford PU !

As I understand it Honda was no longer interested in F1 and only then did RB opt to develop their own PU only to have Honda reverse course after the fact.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by F32Fleet

As I understand it Honda was no longer interested in F1 and only then did RB opt to develop their own PU only to have Honda reverse course after the fact.

This is true. What else was he supposed to do? Either hope that they'd come back or have to find another.
The thing that is promising about RBPT is that they have from what I read, 150 Honda engineers who know the current engine, and all the top guys from MB initial hybrid engine. They have all the right pieces and people in place to do it. Plus the new engine is much more similar to the current powertrain than the switch from NA to hybrid.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by NYG

Something feels different about Ferrari - I think they might get it together. I definitely think they're more likely to be the one to compete for championships than McLaren right now.

Possibly, but then the drivers actually have to be able to bring home a win and neither really strike me as being able to do that - at least not in the magnitude needed. Sai knows Lec is faster but has nothing to lose, like the move he put on in the China sprint race.

[dfox]

Merc is the better seat for him, imo. Unless Stroll moves on, and then AM would be the best seat.

Audi being a new team, taking over a sub-par team, isn't really a great spot.

I think Sainz would step in and outperform Ham at Merc.

I think Checo keeps his seat at RB, regardless of what Max does.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by dfox

Merc is the better seat for him, imo. Unless Stroll moves on, and then AM would be the best seat.

Audi being a new team, taking over a sub-par team, isn't really a great spot.

I think Sainz would step in and outperform Ham at Merc.

I think Checo keeps his seat at RB, regardless of what Max does.

I think you're spot on. Sai would outperform Ham, and Rus might be a tough battle for him. I don't care for Rus, and think, much like Nor, he is overrated and overhyped, but Rus has the fire that Nor doesnt seem to have. Sai is probably going to try to wait for seats, but will likely be a self-fulfilling prophecy for him. The longer he waits in hoping to show how good he is will allow him a better seat all while they get filled or taken by those quick to make decisions.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I think you're spot on. Sai would outperform Ham, and Rus might be a tough battle for him. I don't care for Rus, and think, much like Nor, he is overrated and overhyped, but Rus has the fire that Nor doesnt seem to have. Sai is probably going to try to wait for seats, but will likely be a self-fulfilling prophecy for him. The longer he waits in hoping to show how good he is will allow him a better seat all while they get filled or taken by those quick to make decisions.

It's in Sainz's best interests to get signed ASAP, now that the enjoys wind in his sails and good vibes.

As the season moves on, as long as he doesn't get a contract, more races require him to keep demonstrating consistency in race pace and good results. The longer the 'beauty contest' lasts, the more effort it takes to keep the party going to remain 'attractive' for F1 team bosses. That wouldn't be a problem is he's a super talent race driver. But he ain't (he's very good, but not exceptional like some).

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by Artemis

It's in Sainz's best interests to get signed ASAP, now that the enjoys wind in his sails and good vibes.

As the season moves on, as long as he doesn't get a contract, more races require him to keep demonstrating consistency in race pace and good results. The longer the 'beauty contest' lasts, the more effort it takes to keep the party going to remain 'attractive' for F1 team bosses. That wouldn't be a problem is he's a super talent race driver. But he ain't (he's very good, but not exceptional like some).

I would like to see your poll vote ?

[NYG]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

I would like to see your poll vote ?

Artemis is the Belgian James Bond. You'll never know.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Artemis

It's in Sainz's best interests to get signed ASAP, now that the enjoys wind in his sails and good vibes.

As the season moves on, as long as he doesn't get a contract, more races require him to keep demonstrating consistency in race pace and good results. The longer the 'beauty contest' lasts, the more effort it takes to keep the party going to remain 'attractive' for F1 team bosses. That wouldn't be a problem is he's a super talent race driver. But he ain't (he's very good, but not exceptional like some).

Agreed. Any top 5 team, he's a second driver at best.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by NYG

Artemis is the Belgian James Bond. You'll never know.

Yes he is . But also a great guy and BP moderator !

[2007LotusSC]

I would like to see Sainz at RB but I do not think RB, or even Merc, would take him just for a year only to have him leave and go to Audi for 2026. I think he ends up at Audi and Botas and Guanyu are both out.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Agreed. Any top 5 team, he's a second driver at best.

But currently Sainz has the fire in his eyes . And he'll push it beyond the limits just to beat Charlie in every race in this season.

#FerrariWarHorses !