F1 2023: Azerbaijan GP - Baku (Apr 30)

[G30M]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

If the roles are followed, RUS needs to give position back to Max.
He didn't left him enough room. (twice)

"rules" don't always apply in 1st lap in F1.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by g21

"rules" don't always apply in 1st lap in F1.

Where in the rulebook does it say that it's ok to drive into another car and cause damage and gain a position?
Max left him enough space, and more important, he was ahead and RUS wasn't pushed by someone else. He just drove into him.
He (RUS) said it himself, he had no grip, which means he either was going too fast for the line he was driving or he wasn't steering good enough.
Having no grip is a drivers error.
Surely causing a 50cm hole in the sidepod can't be seen as abiding by the rules...

The crash could be seen as a racing incident, but that still leaves RUS to give the position back.

But at the start from the next safetycar (later in that same lap) Max overtook him again, so I guess that's why no further action was taken.

I guess they're racing different races. Max races for the WDC, RUS has to get points wherever he can, so it's elbows out.

But lets see what happens next time when RUS is put in a similar position. Max can hold a grudge like no one.

[Mr Pete]

Originally Posted by a5m

Max is becoming a whingey bitch like Lulu

You just won dumbest post of the day. Thank you for your contribution!

[G30M]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

Where in the rulebook does it say that it's ok to drive into another car and cause damage and gain a position?.

dude i've been watching F1 longer than Max has been alive.

firstly did the stewards do anything or noted any of the lap 1 incidents today or other days?

when Max was younger he's caused way more damage doing the same thing on lap 1. roles are reversed now.

[Mr Pete]

So, I think I clearly missed something. Didn’t Russell not make it out of q2? And he started p4 for the spring? Is the grid order for sprint based on something else, which I completely missed? Haha

[Mr Pete]

Originally Posted by g21

dude i've been watching F1 longer than Max has been alive

when Max was younger he's caused way more damage doing the same thing on lap 1. roles are reversed now.

Comparing a teenager with zero regard for really anything, to a presumably more mature (based on race experience) mid 20 something ‘veteran’ with 2 world titles?

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Mr Pete

Comparing a teenager with zero regard for really anything, to a presumably more mature (based on race experience) mid 20 something ‘veteran’ with 2 world titles?

did the stewards note the incident(s)?

if not then they let lap 1 go didn't they?

don't look at me i'm not the stewards

i'm just pointing it out

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Mr Pete

Comparing a teenager with zero regard for really anything, to a presumably more mature (based on race experience) mid 20 something ‘veteran’ with 2 world titles?

the point is, in racing those with nothing to lose take more risk than those with more to lose. it's called motor racing.

[Mr Pete]

Originally Posted by g21

did the stewards note the incident(s)?

if not then they let lap 1 go didn't they?

don't look at me i'm not the stewards

i'm just pointing it out

My response to your comment wasn’t regarding the racing stewards’ position on the incident, or lack there of. It was considered a racing incident, to them.

I personally think Russell was at fault, but there was no malintent. He went into that corner hot, and understeered right into Max, unfortunately. Racing incident.

Sprint format is a f’ing joke.

[Mr Pete]

Originally Posted by g21

the point is, in racing those with nothing to lose take more risk than those with more to lose. it's called motor racing.

100% agree with this.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by g21

dude i've been watching F1 longer than Max has been alive.

So have I (I think most of us here have), but I don't see how that is a valid argument.

You specifically noted that certain rules don't apply in the 1st lap.
So I wonder what specific rule you mean that relates to this incident.

firstly did the stewards do anything or noted any of the lap 1 incidents today or other days?

Like I said, the safetycar later that same lap and Max overtaking RUS then probably went a bit too fast for the stewards to react.

when Max was younger he's caused way more damage doing the same thing on lap 1. roles are reversed now.

Even if that's true, that still doesn't make it right (tu quoque fallacy).

I guess an incident like this is the result of changing the sprint race.
The original setup was an alternate way of qualifying for the race where points could be had, but both increasing the points and separating the qualifying bit makes this another race with including risks as drivers might compete or set their chances on the sprint race instead of the main race.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

So have I (I think most of us here have), but I don't see how that is a valid argument.

You specifically noted that certain rules don't apply in the 1st lap.
So I wonder what specific rule you mean that relates to this incident.


Like I said, the safetycar later that same lap and Max overtaking RUS then probably went a bit too fast for the stewards to react.


Even if that's true, that still doesn't make it right (tu quoque fallacy).

I guess an incident like this is the result of changing the sprint race.
The original setup was an alternate way of qualifying for the race where points could be had, but both increasing the points and separating the qualifying bit makes this another race with including risks as drivers might compete or set their chances on the sprint race instead of the main race.

if RBR believe rules have been violated they would appeal for penalty to be applied to GR

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by g21

if RBR believe rules have been violated they would appeal for penalty to be applied to GR

That still doesn't answer the question regarding your claim that certain rules regarding this incident don't apply in the first lap.

And appealing for a penalty after the race would never result in something that RB or Max could benefit from as he already overtook and finished in front of RUS.
So the believe that rules have been violated and appeal for penalty or not are 2 separate things.
If RB believed that no rules had been violated they wouldn't have reported the incident.

[M5Rick]

Evenin' all.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

That still doesn't answer the question regarding your claim that certain rules regarding this incident don't apply in the first lap.

i meant overtaking rules in the very specific FIA picture book

in this case i saw nothing wrong

horner generally agrees, nothing wrong in turn 1 and turn 2. turn 3 he thought george should have given a bit more room.

so no rules were broken here

but if you've seen the FIA picture book, the stewards don't always refer to that in lap 1. unless you're Carlos Sainz last week.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Mate . What would you say ?

Thanks for making a big hole in my car

The fact he was that fast with that huge damage is mindblowing !

During his short and insignificant career the Russell boy has perfectly managed to combine English arrogance with German brutality. Lets hope Mercedes keeps him as he really fits into the mentality there.

Watching it now, 17 laps and Yuki's tyre carcass rolling on the track with Max getting nearly pushed into wall by the Russel boy.

[M5Rick]

Oh Russel DID push Max into the wall, says he lost grip and Max not too impressed with that but Max got past him anyway a few laps later. Roll on the GP.

[M5Rick]

No I got it wrong, Russel's wheel gouged a hole in Max's side pod, ahh a racing incident...or was it.

[Marcoose]

Awww … our defending champion(*)(**) isn’t happy another kids touched his toy. Poor rich dad kid.

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by g21

but if you've seen the FIA picture book, the stewards don't always refer to that in lap 1. unless you're Carlos Sainz last week.

So it's not that rules don't apply, but that stewards migth take a more pragmatic approach to their discretion.
Thats different than what you said before.

[a5m]

Originally Posted by Mr Pete

You just won dumbest post of the day. Thank you for your contribution!

So you know it's true

[Killed by Death]

Unfortunately for George, VER holds a grudge and doesn't forget. There will be payback sooner or later. Just ask Checo.