Plant based diet

[chassis]

Just watched The Game Changers on netflix. Good movie; I consider it a documentary.
https://gamechangersmovie.com/

I am aligned with the movie's favorable view toward a plant-based diet. My experience with a plant-focused diet has been a good one, relative to weight, body composition and mood/energy. I am not a competitive athlete, just an average person trying to live a healthy lifestyle.

Has anyone watched this film? What are your views?

[M_Six]

Originally Posted by chassis

Just watched The Game Changers on netflix. Good movie; I consider it a documentary.
https://gamechangersmovie.com/

I am aligned with the movie's favorable view toward a plant-based diet. My experience with a plant-focused diet has been a good one, relative to weight, body composition and mood/energy. I am not a competitive athlete, just an average person trying to live a healthy lifestyle.

Has anyone watched this film? What are your views?

I haven't seen the film, but we do plant based meals several times a week. We're not vegans, but we do try to limit meat intake and Wifey can't do any dairy at all. We get Purple Carrot meals a few times a month. Got a box coming tomorrow.

[3PedalJake]

This "documentary" is mostly propaganda and has a lot of misrepresentations and partial truths. It is true that you'll see a lot of health benefits when switching from a SAD (standard American diet), but that says more about how unhealthy SAD is than a ringing endorsement for Veganism. Many won't tolerate any criticism of veganism, and I'm not saying you can't be healthy employing it, but it leaves a lot of nutritional gaps unless you go far out of your way to supplement things like B12 and Omega-3. I'd urge you to search "game changers debunked" on YouTube, watch a few of them and come to your own conclusions as to whether this is indeed the healthiest approach.

[chassis]

3PedalJake Thanks. What are the main points you noticed while watching the movie that you reacted to/with?

[3PedalJake]

Omagosh there's so many things to notice about this movie. You can start before the movie does, one of the main producers is Arnold Schwarzenegger who is not in fact a vegan. He claims he cut down on meat consumption for both health and environmental reasons, so right there he A.) knows there is a beneficial quantity of meat consumption B.) Environmental issues have nothing or a very tenuous relation at best to health. Whether plant based is good for the planet is a whole other topic that doesn't belong in a movie about health , and I could make a compelling case for mixed animal husbandry/agriculture as being truly the most earth friendly. But again, that's another topic.

The movie begins by making some dubious claims about gladiators, from the supposed "proof" in strontum levels in bones to the assertion they were "highly prized and cared for" athletes. There were a few who gained enough fame during roman times that their names were recorded, but we don't have many names because they were largely expendable slaves, and were probably fed accordingly.

The athletes in the movie are gifted no doubt, but their achievements are misrepresented somewhat. The strong man Patrik Baboumian is a hulk for sure, but he has not won any competitions at the level of "worlds strongest man" as is implied.

It doesn't take long into the movie to see it is agenda driven rather than evidence, all the anecdotes from the cast aside there's no evidence to say more than plant based doesn't preclude high performance, none to link it directly to such.

Every society since the dawn of man has been omnivore, some more animal based and some more plant based, and of those that remain as traditional societies there are healthy examples of each (see masai, innuit, kitavans, tokalau islanders, paupa new guinans et al). Anyone selling something extreme too hard is suspect IMO. The carnivore ppl are just as bad when they go on with no evidence that our physiology is not designed to break down plants and suggest that broccoli and kale are aKsHuLly bad for you.

[chassis]

Thanks. Are you saying a plant based diet is of no value? Your post seems pretty passionate.

[3PedalJake]

I'm not saying that at all, and I'm mostly only passionate about not falling for propaganda. If you're replacing a SAD diet with vegan your health will improve no doubt about it so if you can do it and are motivated to do it then yes there's value to it, it's just not ideal IMO. It has to be much more specific than just "plant based" to know if it's healthy or not. Just like "keto" is not specific enough, you can do it well or very poorly and still be under the generic term umbrella. Doritos and marshmallows are plant based, and you can do keto on hot dogs and the patty from quarter pounders with cheese, both obviously unhealthy tho. As I said, I believe you can do a healthy version of vegan, but it will handicap you in that it takes a lot of effort to get the required amounts of proteins and vitamins and minerals. Far easier to do what your grandparents and all previous generations knew without any "science" to back them up, I.E. "Eat your meat and your veggies".

As far as what is or isn't healthy goes, as I mentioned in the other thread you have to get your insulin levels under control, that is the key to a efficient, flexible metabolism. This is possible as a vegan, but is much harder because by default you have a much harder time lowering carbs and in turn insulin simply for lack of alternatives.

[Bunnny]

I also second that plant-based diets are unhealthy in reality, because of also alot of the additives in vegan convenience food (premade & processed items). Soy, sun flower lectin, and more than normal amounts of artificial flavoring and colors, can disrupt hormones and regular organ function.
I can also say that regular vegetables can sit in your stomach forever while being digested. This doesn't do you much good if you have just done a work out and your body is in need of nutrients and protein STAT, and will do the opposite (hang on to fat cells). This is relevant to soluble and insoluble fiber, but still the amount of nutrients received from meat far outweighs veggies.
And again, chemicals or preservatives/unfamiliar foods the body will just put into fat cells for later, contributing to other factors.

[BMWILUVU]

I don't think plant-based diets are completely unhealthy but processed plant-foods are. You are right plant-based diets are not the be all end all. Problem is, almost everything around us is filled with industrial by-products now. The freshwater study testing sampling showed petroleum products in all the water tested around the country. Then think about the chemicals like round-up and lawn products homeowners and farmers spray. They go right into the waste water and water processing and the plants suck that up. The problem with meats in this modern age is that all of the toxins plants accrue are magnified by feeding them to livestock. The meat we eat have so much hormone, antibiotic, and plant toxins in them to make us sick. Forget about fish, the worst for obvious reasons.

[tcphoto]

I injured my ACL back in February, I was having a lot of pain and decided to stop running for a month. It was about that time that I watched the show and it motivated me to try the diet. I've had a few emails with Charity and hope to shoot some of her recipes and lifestyle images in the future. I don't know if it's coincidence but I felt like my knee pain eased considerably and I've nearly recovered from the injury. Truth be told, I do eat meat once or twice a month but I will say that I feel better since changing my diet back in June.

[3PedalJake]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

I don't think plant-based diets are completely unhealthy but processed plant-foods are. You are right plant-based diets are not the be all end all. Problem is, almost everything around us is filled with industrial by-products now. The freshwater study testing sampling showed petroleum products in all the water tested around the country. Then think about the chemicals like round-up and lawn products homeowners and farmers spray. They go right into the waste water and water processing and the plants suck that up. The problem with meats in this modern age is that all of the toxins plants accrue are magnified by feeding them to livestock. The meat we eat have so much hormone, antibiotic, and plant toxins in them to make us sick. Forget about fish, the worst for obvious reasons.

More specifically in regards to "processed", it's not even the accidental toxins introduced along the way, some of it is specifically by design toxic. Number one worst offender is "vegetable oil", that has problems on a lot of levels. For starters it's high in Omega 6 fats and not just prone to oxidation but comes that way from the factory. When these damaged fatty acids get incorporated in your tissue as in your mitochondrial cell membranes it's the exact biologic equivalent of a battery with an internal short. The "partially hydrogenated" oils are 10x wors than those even.
"processed wheat" is a mechanical process where it's pulverized in a roller mill for the same reasons a cokehead chops up his line nice and fine, to make it instantly absorb for the rush. That's what processed wheat does, but the rush you don't know about is the insulin spike because the processed wheat is converted into glucose within minutes of chewing it. Keep that up all day long with cookies and crackers and bread and that's how you get T2D.
Sugar is half glucose and half fructose. An overload of glucose isn't good for you for above reason, but fructose is a toxin that the body treats the same way as alcohol, that is that it can only be metabolized by the liver, the rest of the body can't use it and doesn't want it, this is why soda guzzlers get NAFLD and have livers that look just like an alcoholic.
All those things are technically "vegan", and they're what the majority of ppl vegan or not default to, that's why e1 is so unhealthy these days you can graph it along with the consumption of crap.
I believe a kind of "neo-paleo" works best. I eat a lot of plants, lots of shellfish and low on the foodchain fish like mackerel and sardines, limited amounts of pastured beef. No processed crap.

More important than what you eat is what you don't eat, if it comes in a plastic bag or cardboard box it's probably bad for you. If it comes from the perimeter of the grocery store where real foods are it's probably OK.

Also as important is WHEN you eat, the "small meals frequently" strategy needs to be put to rest. But I digress, maybe in another thread

[Housekeeping]

Read The China Study, it’ll change your life….if you allow it

[chassis]

3PedalJake What's your view on the higher mortality rate in the US for coronary artery disease, compared with for example Canada, Spain, France, UK or Japan?

To what extent does diet play a role in this?

[3PedalJake]

Originally Posted by Sy1616

Read The China Study, it’ll change your life….if you allow it

This is the study based on feeding rats casein and exposing them to aflatoxins, and extrapolating to "meat causes cancer in humans". Read Weston A. Price Foundation rebuttal "The China Study Myth" to see this flawed study completely dismantled.

[floridaorange]

eat some meat just be sure to eat your fruits snd veggies every day

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by chassis

Just watched The Game Changers on netflix. Good movie; I consider it a documentary.
https://gamechangersmovie.com/

I am aligned with the movie's favorable view toward a plant-based diet. My experience with a plant-focused diet has been a good one, relative to weight, body composition and mood/energy. I am not a competitive athlete, just an average person trying to live a healthy lifestyle.

Has anyone watched this film? What are your views?

I became a vegan after watching that documentary in April. I notice a difference in my health, and was measurable on my physical.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

I don't think plant-based diets are completely unhealthy but processed plant-foods are. You are right plant-based diets are not the be all end all. Problem is, almost everything around us is filled with industrial by-products now. The freshwater study testing sampling showed petroleum products in all the water tested around the country. Then think about the chemicals like round-up and lawn products homeowners and farmers spray. They go right into the waste water and water processing and the plants suck that up. The problem with meats in this modern age is that all of the toxins plants accrue are magnified by feeding them to livestock. The meat we eat have so much hormone, antibiotic, and plant toxins in them to make us sick. Forget about fish, the worst for obvious reasons.

It would scare you to find out how bad this actually is.

[beehmer101]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

I became a vegan after watching that documentary in April. I notice a difference in my health, and was measurable on my physical.

I noticed a difference, as well!! I think it might not be right for everyone, but everyone should at least give it a try.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by beehmer101

I noticed a difference, as well!! I think it might not be right for everyone, but everyone should at least give it a try.

I think the issue is people not supplementing (B12 for sure) but also not having or feeling like the have options. I do think you’re right that it’s not the most optimal for everyone though

[chassis]

There are a ton of enjoyable and high quality non-meat food items and meals possible. Too many to list. Think of the billions (!) of people in the world eating low- or no-meat diets out of choice or necessity. These global cuisines are where to look for cooking inspiration.

[IllSic_Design]

Originally Posted by 3PedalJake

It is true that you'll see a lot of health benefits when switching from a SAD (standard American diet), but that says more about how unhealthy SAD is than a ringing endorsement for Veganism.

I think this is the main thing that people assume comes from only the plant based diet lifestyle, but it's mainly that they stop eating the mostly processed/toxic crap that most americans consume.

[Humdizzle]

my GF is vegan.

i honestly felt ALOT better switching over to a more plant based diet. no more tired feeling after meals. more energy through the day at work. i'm a type 1 diabetic and my a1c and cholesterol is the best its ever been. skin is alot healthier. its crazy how good the vegan stuff has gotten compared to real meat. i had vegan sushi in LA was blown away how close they can make a tomato taste and feel like salmon. really i think the only thing they don't have down is cheese, it doesn't melt or brown like real cheese. oat milk and icecream tastes about the same.

but yeah alot of it is just eating 'cleaner' and buying stuff without all the additives in it. i was eating fast food all the time before her.

i'll still eat fried chicken and sushi every once in a while. maybe red meat or real dairy on occasion. but its rare, we don't keep it in the house.