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      03-12-2019, 06:25 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .2pdk View Post
Guess who...
I started a thread on this forum a few months back regarding the Islamic Party of Ontario and got all kinds of pushback from the usual suspects. This is a change that can't happen overnight but a slow change as more muslims enter politics and the muslim population grows there could be significant changes to western democracy. I have no issues with muslims coming to the west for the things that the west offers. That's a long list but really freedom from what is in many of the countries that they have fled. What confuses me, and I get democracy evolves, but what the desire to bring the very things they are fleeing into the sanctuary they seek?

https://torontosun.com/opinion/colum...rty-of-ontario
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      03-12-2019, 06:55 AM   #46
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after a period of careful consideration, and in a show of uncharacteristic self control i have decided to stay out of this thread. I would hate to think that anything i did would cause this woman to leave the spotlight until after DJT is re-elected....or even until after the 2022 mid-terms.
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      03-12-2019, 07:49 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Singing "Well, isn't she lovely..."

So she stuck her foot in her mouth again last night - said that Trump and his kind aren't even human beings.



https://twitter.com/RealSaavedra/sta...human-n2542968
She was asked to if Trump was the same as Obama, she said absolutely not, one is human the other is not. Maybe she was talking about Obama.
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      03-12-2019, 07:58 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Update - Former Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan David Duke called Omar “the most important members” in Congress. Yes, Omar has received the endorsement of a white nationalist most likely due to her hatred of Israel and Jews. That’s the far left.

Note anything a tad odd after this Duke endorsement. There was zero media coverage, whereas Trump is besieged whenever these clowns talk about him.

Also, it would appear as if CNN has zero stories about Duke and Omar. Want to guess how many are about Trump and Duke on the site?

https://twitter.com/RealSaavedra/sta...-omar-n2542825

https://twitter.com/LevineJonathan/s...-omar-n2542825

This pretty much cancels out the shoddy narrative that Trump is somehow a white nationalist because some cuckoo said a nice thing about him. The same standard does apply. Of course, Omar isn’t a member or supporter of the KKK, but these are their rules, folks. They get away with murder.

Who else on "the far left" is as anti-Israel and anti-Jewish as Omar appears to be?

I've got a funny feeling that if asked about him, Omar will have zero difficulties denouncing Duke. Our President cannot say the same thing.
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      03-12-2019, 08:10 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
Who else on "the far left" is as anti-Israel and anti-Jewish as Omar appears to be?

I've got a funny feeling that if asked about him, Omar will have zero difficulties denouncing Duke. Our President cannot say the same thing.

1) Has she denounced him? We could play the "what if" game all day, but has she said she doesn't approve of his support?

2) Apparently the bulk of the current democrat party is on the 'far left' since they can't even vote to condemn her for what she said.


When Rep. King made his terrible statements, the republicans swiftly booted him from all his committees. What ramifications has Omar endured? Oh yeah, none.
I understand Trump has not denounced king.
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      03-12-2019, 08:14 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
1) Has she denounced him? We could play the "what if" game all day, but has she said she doesn't approve of his support?
Has she been asked about his comments and what her thoughts are on them? Trump was, he fumbled.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
2) Apparently the bulk of the current democrat party is on the 'far left' since they can't even vote to condemn her for what she said.
While I agree that the Dems choice to go with an "All Lives Matter" resolution vs. just focusing on anti-Semitism was a bad choice. Pretty sure lots of high profile Dems criticized her comments, they just didn't pull her from her committee(s). That doesn't back up your earlier claim. Bernie Sanders is about as far left as the current Democratic party gets - I'm betting he's not an anti-Semite. What about Harris, has she said/done anything anti-Semitic? Warren? Those are about the farthest left Dems in Wash right now (I'm leaving off AOC because she's too new to matter).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
When Rep. King made his terrible statements, the republicans swiftly booted him from all his committees. What ramifications has Omar endured? Oh yeah, none.
King has a much, MUCH longer track record of saying inflammatory stuff and holding controversial positions, however. What you're essentially advocating for here in this comparison is that King gets a "six strikes, you're out" policy and Omar gets a "one, maybe two strikes, you're out" policy.
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      03-12-2019, 08:51 AM   #51
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[QUOTE=hooligan_COLD;24504408]Has she been asked about his comments and what her thoughts are on them? Trump was, he fumbled.




While I agree that the Dems choice to go with an "All Lives Matter" resolution vs. just focusing on anti-Semitism was a bad choice. Pretty sure lots of high profile Dems criticized her comments, they just didn't pull her from her committee(s). That doesn't back up your earlier claim. Bernie Sanders is about as far left as the current Democratic party gets - I'm betting he's not an anti-Semite. What about Harris, has she said/done anything anti-Semitic? Warren? Those are about the farthest left Dems in Wash right now (I'm leaving off AOC because she's too new to matter).


I get the sense that AOC is farther left than Bernie, he's out there but at least he has thought out his policies and positions. AOC just blurts shit out and some of it is pretty out there. I doubt Bernie is an anti-semite, nor is AOC I suspect, but are they coming out and condemning Oman? Nobody on the left really are.
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      03-12-2019, 09:08 AM   #52
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[QUOTE=Grumpy Old Man;24504542]
Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post


I get the sense that AOC is farther left than Bernie, he's out there but at least he has thought out his policies and positions. AOC just blurts shit out and some of it is pretty out there. I doubt Bernie is an anti-semite, nor is AOC I suspect, but are they coming out and condemning Oman? Nobody on the left really are.
?

I guess he has thought them out, as he has never held down a real job (like Obama).

On 2nd thought, no. He has not "thought them out".
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      03-12-2019, 09:16 AM   #53
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[QUOTE=Real Dodger;24504619]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post

?

I guess he has thought them out, as he has never held down a real job (like Obama).

On 2nd thought, no. He has not "thought them out".
I guess that's the best comparator between Bernie and AOC.
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      03-12-2019, 09:23 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
I get the sense that AOC is farther left than Bernie, he's out there but at least he has thought out his policies and positions. AOC just blurts shit out and some of it is pretty out there. I doubt Bernie is an anti-semite, nor is AOC I suspect, but are they coming out and condemning Oman? Nobody on the left really are.
Not true:

...House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Eliot Engel, D-N.Y., who is Jewish, called it "a vile anti-Semitic slur." Engel has not called for Omar's removal from his panel, as some House Republicans have done.

House Appropriations Committee Chairwoman Nita Lowey, D-N.Y., tweeted criticism of Omar's comments in which she called on Omar to apologize because "lawmakers must be able to debate w/o prejudice or bigotry."
...

...The House voted 424-0 last month on a Republican motion to condemn anti-Semitism following a controversy over Omar's tweets in which she suggested lawmakers support Israel only because of Jewish lobbying influence and money...

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/04/70016...rep-ilhan-omar

Last time I checked, Engel, Lowey and a whole bunch of other Dems comprised a good portion of that 424 votes in the House of Representatives. Further, I seem to remember lots of Dems voicing criticism of her statements back when they happened, just not advocating for removing her from any committee. I'm having a tough time digging up links, though, as Google is returning more current stuff. I'll keep looking.

Would I prefer to see EVERY politician condemn her remarks? Yes. You can't always get what you want....
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      03-12-2019, 09:25 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
Not true:

...House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Eliot Engel, D-N.Y., who is Jewish, called it "a vile anti-Semitic slur." Engel has not called for Omar's removal from his panel, as some House Republicans have done.

House Appropriations Committee Chairwoman Nita Lowey, D-N.Y., tweeted criticism of Omar's comments in which she called on Omar to apologize because "lawmakers must be able to debate w/o prejudice or bigotry."
...

...The House voted 424-0 last month on a Republican motion to condemn anti-Semitism following a controversy over Omar's tweets in which she suggested lawmakers support Israel only because of Jewish lobbying influence and money...

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/04/70016...rep-ilhan-omar

Last time I checked, Engel, Lowey and a whole bunch of other Dems comprised a good portion of that 424 votes in the House of Representatives. Further, I seem to remember lots of Dems voicing criticism of her statements back when they happened, just not advocating for removing her from any committee. I'm having a tough time digging up links, though, as Google is returning more current stuff. I'll keep looking.
My statement was a bit broad, I guess my view is they aren't coming out strongly against her.
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      03-12-2019, 09:45 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Man View Post
My statement was a bit broad, I guess my view is they aren't coming out strongly against her.
I will certainly agree with that.


ETA - I believe this is one of the reports that I remembered and alluded to earlier in the thread:


...Pelosi and other House Democratic leaders said in a statement Monday, “Congresswoman Omar’s use of anti-Semitic tropes and prejudicial accusations about Israel’s supporters is deeply offensive.” They added, “We condemn these remarks and we call upon Congresswoman Omar to immediately apologize for these hurtful comments.”

Pelosi was joined in the message by House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer of Maryland, third-ranking Democrat James Clyburn of South Carolina and three other members of House Democratic leadership
...

http://fortune.com/2019/02/11/freshm...mitic-remarks/
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      03-12-2019, 10:11 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
But, but, but Trump! That's a solid argument, my friend.


3[/url]
Its actually not an argument. Its a fact.

Here is what troubles me.
Rep. Crenshaw makes a great point. She (Omar) should be stripped of her committee slots. He makes a good criticism of the Democratic party.
and
Dan Crenshaw

Verified account

@DanCrenshawTX
Mar 8
More Dan Crenshaw Retweeted Peter J. Hasson
Like I keep saying, @IlhanMN is just trying to tell us what she really thinks. She thinks this is all just “faux outrage.”

It isn’t. And that’s a bipartisan opinion.

Stop covering for her, Madam Speaker
.

Addressing specific behaviours and condemning them. Good for him!



Trump?
President Donald Trump told reporters that the Democrats’ vote on a resolution condemning anti-Semitism was “disgraceful because the Democrats have become an anti-Israel party. They have become an anti-Jewish party.”
Is that true? No, but its a nice dog whistle for his alt-right media buddies and his base.
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      03-12-2019, 11:54 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Well - yes, they said that, and then completely backpedaled just a few days later with Pelosi stating that it was okay because Omar just didn't realize her words were hurtful and Clyburn making the moronic statement that it was okay because of what she endured in Somalia, which he then proceeded to make even worse by saying that it was more impactful then your parents being sent to concentration camps as a Jew.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi..._she_used.html

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...t-comments-in/

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4...caust-comments

I know we don't always agree politically, but I am flabbergasted that you are defending this degenerate behavior.
Probably because I'm not defending anything.

What specific "degenerate behavior" do you think I'm attempting to defend?
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      03-12-2019, 11:55 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
...So now you're going to use the "but Trump" argument too? Come now...
Nope, I'm not. You started the Trump comparison, not me.
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      03-12-2019, 12:27 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Unless I am missing something, I don't see where I compared Trump to anything Omar has said?
Allow me to help you out:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
...This pretty much cancels out the shoddy narrative that Trump is somehow a white nationalist because some cuckoo said a nice thing about him. The same standard does apply. Of course, Omar isn’t a member or supporter of the KKK, but these are their rules, folks. They get away with murder.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
If you are okay with the Democrats refusal to denounce antisemitism, then that is certainly degenerate behavior.
Please show where I've done that. In fact, I specifically stated I held a position opposite to the one you assign to me above.
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      03-12-2019, 01:46 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Okay - so I've reread everything we have both posted, and I don't understand what we are arguing about?

I'm so confused.

Do you agree that the democrats as a party, including party leadership, have not really denounced Omar and her antisemitism? Even though a few have stated they object, several have since backpedaled. For those that have not, they are literally 1 or 2 out of nearly 500 that continue to support her.
#1 - Continuing to support and condemning what she said are not mutually exclusive positions.

#2 - Yes, as I've already stated, I would much prefer to have seen consistent and strong condemnation of what Omar said across the entire party (and outside the party, too).



Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Thanks for the clarification about Trump - but I stand by that. Do you not agree? So many raised a stink about about certain right-wing fringe radicals supporting Trump, but yet none (or at least an extremely small few) have made the same comments about Omar and Duke giving her props.

I don't think either should have been called out, but it screams of hypocritical faux outrage by so many.
It's not an apples/apples comparison. The stink was raised because Trump was asked about Duke's support by reporters, on camera, and still failed to denounce Duke and distance himself from what Duke represents. Omar has not, to the best of my knowledge, been given that opportunity.
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      03-12-2019, 02:06 PM   #62
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Quote:
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There in lies the rub, and the crux of my argument. No one in the MSM has bothered to ask her that question. Wonder why that is......?
What's stopping a reporter from Fox or Breitbart or whatever your right-wing source of choice is from asking it?

FWIW, that point was not at all clear in your earlier posts, IMO.
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      03-12-2019, 03:04 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
Well - in my defense, I am going on day 40 without a day off and without leaving the office before 9pm, so there is a bit of delirium going about.


One thing the right wing media needs to look out for. By "normalizing" the word "socialist" in their coverage, they are amplifying their far left message. Trumps "message" was amplified by the MSM in 2016, and helped him win. The same lesson can be applied to overcoverage of the far left.
Those that are saying "its great for trump when aoc or Omar gets coverage" better be careful about what they ask for. You should hope for more coverage of Biden. If the dems are going to win in 2020 (they have a better than 50/50 chance), Biden is the best choice we can hope for.
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      03-12-2019, 03:04 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan_COLD View Post
What's stopping a reporter from Fox or Breitbart or whatever your right-wing source of choice is from asking it?

FWIW, that point was not at all clear in your earlier posts, IMO.
Uhh, maybe because when Peter Doocy from Fox tried to ask her a question while walking along side her through the halls, she completely ignored him. Wouldn't even look at him.

Just saying.
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      03-12-2019, 03:09 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
There in lies the rub, and the crux of my argument. No one in the MSM has bothered to ask her that question. Wonder why that is......?
It seems that every time she has a chance to de-escalate, she simply puts her foot in her mouth. Yum!

For Rep. Ilhan Omar, 2 apologies in 3 weeks for 'anti-Semitic tropes ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../r...emitic-tropes/
Feb 11, 2019 - Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-Minn.) has been a member of Congress for a little over a month. But for the second time, she has apologized for circulating ...


Though this is a bit of a surprise:
https://abc7amarillo.com/news/nation...-jeanine-pirro
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      03-12-2019, 03:16 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmyx6go View Post
Uhh, maybe because when Peter Doocy from Fox tried to ask her a question while walking along side her through the halls, she completely ignored him. Wouldn't even look at him.

Just saying.
Did he ask her that question?

The point isn't whether she'll let Fox interview her or not. The point is Trump was asked, and still managed to fuck up the answer. Thus, it is not a valid comparison to Omar.

Again, just because I know people don't read entire threads, this is not - IN ANY WAY - me endorsing what Omar said or the milktoast "backlash" from the Dems in Washington.
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