New Ytest
Sign out
Bimmerpost
Login
BMW E39 5-Series Forum | 5Post.com
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read  
Go Back   BMW E39 5-Series Forum | 5Post.com > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General BMW News and Cars Discussion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-12-2022, 01:00 PM   #23
kyleb350
Brigadier General
kyleb350's Avatar
United_States
422
Rep
4,709
Posts

 
Drives: '21 X3MC
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Milwaukee

iTrader: (6)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Prototypes have been hiding in plain sight.
That would be M8 based, not M4 CSL. I would prefer that ^^ though
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 01:10 PM   #24
BitchinManWheels
Lieutenant
BitchinManWheels's Avatar
United_States
344
Rep
573
Posts

 
Drives: Dinan M4, Z4, X5, Raptor
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Shavertown, PA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by stein_325i View Post
$600k and based on a regular BMW platform and tuned variant of the S58? At that price, I would expect a completely bespoke car.
For real!!!
For $600k it should be a halo car like a hybrid i8 with S55 engine making 1000hp!
__________________
"When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting."
Appreciate 2
The_Werm212.00
Robin_NL8679.50
      05-12-2022, 01:27 PM   #25
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

 
Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kyleb350 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Prototypes have been hiding in plain sight.
That would be M8 based, not M4 CSL. I would prefer that ^^ though
It's a GT Motorsport platform that underpins both the M8GTE/LM and M4 GT3. P58 engine up front, hybridized LMDh transaxle in the back.

The only M8 specific body part is the rear bumper.
Appreciate 4
EXE462097.00
Frosty772.50
Ibiza3480.00
CanAutM321104.50
      05-12-2022, 01:58 PM   #26
10"
Colonel
10"'s Avatar
No_Country
4946
Rep
2,263
Posts

 
Drives: orange BMW 1M.
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: world

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by stein_325i View Post
$600k and based on a regular BMW platform and tuned variant of the S58? At that price, I would expect a completely bespoke car.
For real!!!
For $600k it should be a halo car like a hybrid i8 with S55 engine making 1000hp!
that's not what everyone wants.

A manual car with retro styling and wild design is worth something always.

Not everyone wants the latest and greatest some people want something more special
__________________
don't read this. too late...
Appreciate 6
F87EVO4004.00
Davil6333.50
      05-12-2022, 01:59 PM   #27
stein_325i
Ring Leader of G8X Haters
stein_325i's Avatar
No_Country
25051
Rep
8,761
Posts

 
Drives: A Car
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: All-Around

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 10" View Post
that's not what everyone wants.

A manual car with retro styling and wild design is worth something always.

Not everyone wants the latest and greatest some people want something more special
That's the point though, a bespoke vehicle would be more special than something sharing the platform of crossovers and sedans. It would make sense at a lower price point, but at well above a half-million dollars its a completely different segment.
__________________
Current Garage: 2022 Mercedes-Benz S 580 / 2023 Genesis GV70 2.5T / 2007 Mercedes-Benz E 350 / 1999 Mazda MX-5 Miata
Retired: '95 E36 325i 5MT / '04 E46 330i 6MT / '05 E83 X3 3.0i / '11 E90 335xi / '17 G30 540i / '19 F87 M2C 6MT / '19 MB CLS 53 / '20 MB GLC 300
Appreciate 2
Mavus2014.50
The_Werm212.00
      05-12-2022, 02:06 PM   #28
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

 
Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by stein_325i View Post
$600k and based on a regular BMW platform and tuned variant of the S58? At that price, I would expect a completely bespoke car.
What if it actually is?
Appreciate 1
Frosty772.50
      05-12-2022, 03:01 PM   #29
F87EVO
Major
F87EVO's Avatar
Cyprus
4004
Rep
1,221
Posts

 
Drives: BMW F87 M2 CS (6MT)
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Europa

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
In case you missed this. Who knows if this means something !

https://www.bmw-m.com/en/topics/maga...lara-lmdh.html
Attached Images
 
__________________
Sometimes, the simplest recipes, done well, with quality ingredients, are the tastiest, - evo Car of the Year 2020
2020 BMW F87 M2 CS - 6MT - Misano Blue Metallic
Appreciate 1
Deluxx3200.00
      05-12-2022, 03:11 PM   #30
ynguldyn
Brigadier General
7578
Rep
3,423
Posts

 
Drives: battery powered tv on wheels
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
So you are saying this is not the same car as the GT/H and something different?
I'm checking, should know soon.

This is basically where my research falls flat: I don't know how a car will look, and I can't predict how a car will ultimately be named. It's possible in this specific case BMW intentionally used a temporary name during the development process.

Again, I hope to know soon if this is the same or a different car. Though for betting purposes I'd pick "same".
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 03:39 PM   #31
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

 
Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by xlover View Post
So you are saying this is not the same car as the GT/H and something different?
I'm checking, should know soon.

This is basically where my research falls flat: I don't know how a car will look, and I can't predict how a car will ultimately be named. It's possible in this specific case BMW intentionally used a temporary name during the development process.

Again, I hope to know soon if this is the same or a different car. Though for betting purposes I'd pick "same".
Should see 9ML/MM/or MR and something similar to 10Z.
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 04:22 PM   #32
BitchinManWheels
Lieutenant
BitchinManWheels's Avatar
United_States
344
Rep
573
Posts

 
Drives: Dinan M4, Z4, X5, Raptor
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Shavertown, PA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 10" View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by stein_325i View Post
$600k and based on a regular BMW platform and tuned variant of the S58? At that price, I would expect a completely bespoke car.
For real!!!
For $600k it should be a halo car like a hybrid i8 with S55 engine making 1000hp!
that's not what everyone wants.

A manual car with retro styling and wild design is worth something always.

Not everyone wants the latest and greatest some people want something more special
Understood. Like a Singer. Buuuuut this from factory and $600k for a new BMW! I can see this from Porsche and definitely Ferrari but a half million dollar new BMW??!
The M4 CSL is looking to push $200k and I think that's crazy.
Reminds me of the M4 GTS craze, how did that work out…
__________________
"When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting."
Appreciate 2
BigHunk269.50
      05-12-2022, 06:09 PM   #33
ynguldyn
Brigadier General
7578
Rep
3,423
Posts

 
Drives: battery powered tv on wheels
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Should see 9ML/MM/or MR and something similar to 10Z.
9ML is the key that unlocked it all for me. And it's nowhere else which is why I don't know for sure but am willing to bet on the "same".
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 06:18 PM   #34
Hegge
Banned
880
Rep
790
Posts

 
Drives: 2020 BMW M2 CS
Join Date: May 2015
Location: PA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
Understood. Like a Singer. Buuuuut this from factory and $600k for a new BMW! I can see this from Porsche and definitely Ferrari but a half million dollar new BMW??!
The M4 CSL is looking to push $200k and I think that's crazy.
Reminds me of the M4 GTS craze, how did that work out…
Agree with all of this.
Appreciate 3
      05-12-2022, 06:21 PM   #35
GuidoK
#buildnotbought
GuidoK's Avatar
10473
Rep
4,815
Posts

 
Drives: Z4 3.0i ESS TS2+
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Tinkering in the garage

iTrader: (0)

I think it's still down on power.
__________________
Z4 3.0i | ESS TS2+ supercharger | Quaife ATB LSD | Brembo/BMW performance BBK front/rear | Schrick FI cams | Schmiedmann headers+cats | Powerflex/strongflex PU bushings | Vibra-technics engine mounts | H&R anti rollbars | KW V3 coilovers/KW camber plates | Sachs race engineering clutch | tons of custom sh#t
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 06:30 PM   #36
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

 
Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Should see 9ML/MM/or MR and something similar to 10Z.
9ML is the key that unlocked it all for me. And it's nowhere else which is why I don't know for sure but am willing to bet on the "same".
The only things I'm sure of that can be derived from the available info:

The misleading 3 = BMW Motorsport; not 3=US

GT = GT Development Variant (Transaxle arrangement)

H: References to Hommage, Homologation, and Hybrid have been used; all 3 would be accurate.

Transmission MAN = Automated Conventional Manual
Appreciate 3
FrankieNuo1210.00
manuelf340.00
CanAutM321104.50
      05-12-2022, 06:37 PM   #37
ynguldyn
Brigadier General
7578
Rep
3,423
Posts

 
Drives: battery powered tv on wheels
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Boston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The only things I'm sure of that can be derived from the available info:

The misleading 3 = BMW Motorsport; not 3=US

GT = GT Development Variant (Transaxle arrangement)

H: References to Hommage, Homologation, and Hybrid have been used; all 3 would be accurate.

Transmission MAN = Automated Conventional Manual
83AZ is there only as a reminder of what could've been. They will only make 81AZ and 82AZ.
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 07:09 PM   #38
lemetier
Plenipotentiary
lemetier's Avatar
2614
Rep
3,046
Posts

 
Drives: Yes
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Location

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The only things I'm sure of that can be derived from the available info:

The misleading 3 = BMW Motorsport; not 3=US

GT = GT Development Variant (Transaxle arrangement)

H: References to Hommage, Homologation, and Hybrid have been used; all 3 would be accurate.

Transmission MAN = Automated Conventional Manual
83AZ is there only as a reminder of what could've been. They will only make 81AZ and 82AZ.
Show & Display with mileage cap works just fine for the very few US investors.
Appreciate 1
Frosty772.50
      05-12-2022, 07:53 PM   #39
Artemis
Moderator
Artemis's Avatar
28915
Rep
13,048
Posts

 
Drives: BMW M2 Competition
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Belgium

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
It's possible in this specific case BMW intentionally used a temporary name during the development process.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
Should see 9ML/MM/or MR and something similar to 10Z.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
9ML is the key that unlocked it all for me. And it's nowhere else which is why I don't know for sure but am willing to bet on the "same".
This source reported in April 2021 about BMW M über projects with code names "ML" and "MXL" (see here).

And about the rumored 'Project Katharina': named after the St. Katharina church (aka Katharinenkirche) in Garching.
Gary C.J. Schweikert - 15 April 2021

Her name is Katharina, and right now she is everyone’s darling at the Bavarian Motor Works. Her address is Daimlerstrasse 19 in Garching-Hochbrück, epicentre of the go-faster BMW M division. But Katharina also has second homes at the Nürburgring and in Miramas, where BMW keeps its biggest proving ground. Kathy – if you don’t mind – has been spotted several times on public roads recently, where her swirly camouflage attracted the attention of spy photographers.
Because Katharina is not a person but a project. A project that at a glance looks like the BMW M2 CS. Except from behind, where that car’s four trademark exhaust pipes are conspicuous by their absence. Close your eyes, listen, and another point of difference becomes clear – Katharina’s high-pitched soundtrack is a far cry from the growling, multi-cylinder racket with which M cars are synonymous. This M2 sounds like absolutely nothing else, which is perfectly okay, because there is no other car like it.
Next year, M division will celebrate its 50th anniversary. Such an occasion warrants a pretty special birthday present. You guessed it: the car expected to roll out of the cake and blow out the candles with plenty of brouhaha is Project Katharina – a very special electric M2.
At this point in time it’s based on the M2 CS. But come 2022 the new rear-wheel-drive G42 2-series will make a much better fit, even though an M version of that car won’t surface before 2023. In the unlikely scenario of the M development team having to step back from the 2-series, the monstrous DNA of Katharina the Great could be transferred easily, and at short notice, to the M3 or M4.
And what a monster this is! One megawatt of raw power – that’s 1000kW, or 1321bhp. Think about that for a moment. This awesome kraftwerk consists of four electric motors, one per wheel. Together they offer a radically advanced level of torque vectoring hitherto available only to the cars you see in cartoons. This constantly variable, four-figure, on-demand punch is supported by the most extreme battery technology conceived to date at the group’s future-energy campus on the outskirts of Munich.
Although this is all still top-secret stuff, reliable sources claim Katharina has already lapped the Nordschleife in under seven minutes, besting the hardly underpowered M8 Competition by more than 40 seconds and putting the electric M2 in Porsche Taycan Turbo S territory. We don’t yet know how many laps the future uber-BMW can run before being black-flagged by excessive tyre wear, cooling issues or a fast-receding state of charge. But in a way that’s immaterial, because the key mission of this advanced M2 is to confirm that emissions-free high performance and M-level handling can go hand in hand.
Acceleration from a standing start is expected to split the 2.0 to 2.5sec bracket. At least as impressive is the brutal throttle response at speed, when wheelspin can be induced in the dry even above 75mph, sources say. So far, Katharina is a work in progress and not yet an approved programme. But according to information gathered from an English powertrain specialist involved in the R&D work, a run of stripped-out and relatively ascetic (no rear seats; carbonfibre panels and roof; hollow-spoke mag wheels; thin-walled glass) limited-edition specials is very much on the cards. Watch this space. And start saving.
This spring, BMW showed the undisguised production i4 – a proper electric BMW with batteries in its belly and enough poke to please impatient speed junkies. Marketing pulled the launch forward three months to out-click the competition and to leave enough ramp-up room for the iX SUV, which debuts only three months later in November.
But where the i4 gets really exciting is when you add the letter M and some lessons from Katharina and find yourself with the 600bhp i4M, complete with a big, fat 120kWh battery. This car is in the works, and its job will be to democratise some of the tech that promises to make that battery-electric hyper-M2 a gamechanger.
Fundamental to the electrification of M will be the hardware at its disposal. BMW’s high-voltage energy system, known as HEAT, comes in three basic sizes. On top of this volume-biased threesome, insiders expect two high-performance variations masterminded by the M division and accordingly labelled ML and MXL.
We’re talking 125kWh-plus batteries here, but what matters even more is the different cell chemistry, which promises an increased number of fast-charging and discharge cycles, a balanced mix of regeneration, performance and coasting sequences, intelligent cooling management and advanced performance electronics. The voltage is expected to increase from 400 to 800 volts (increasing voltage reduces resistance losses, while also reducing weight – thanks to slimmer, lighter cabling – and accelerating charging times) and BMW is even toying with 1200 volts. But at this level the regulators still require impracticalities like documented grounding after every charge…
But if the great Pirelli adverts of the past have taught us one thing, it’s that power is nothing without control. And it’s in this key area – the melding of chassis set-up, stability-control systems and power electronics into a cohesive driving experience – that BMW can point to the i3 and i8 and argue they were not a waste of time. Both drove brilliantly, with the i3 particularly impressive given its unlikely shape and footprint.
And a great deal of time and money has gone into R&D since. Look at the i3S, which debuted a more intelligent eDrive powertrain in which, rather than being tamed by a remote stability-control system, the car’s punchy output was regulated at source, within the drive unit itself, by systems able to respond 50 times faster than a conventional set-up. Then there’s the new hardware, BMW’s fifth-generation eDrive, which arrived on the iX3 and will give the i4 the best possible start in life. If the iX3 is a fairly unremarkable electric SUV on paper, on the road – most unexpectedly – it drives with a poise and a precision that calls to mind the best of BMW’s engine-powered SUVs. And if Frank Weber and his team can pull off something of an Ultimate Driving Machine with that unpromising set of components, imagine what it can achieve with the i4M, based as it will be on the same CLAR platform that the new M3/M4, with a few choice modifications, is putting to such good use right now.
Between now and 2025, all new electric BMWs will be based on advanced versions of the current FAAR and CLAR architectures. One of the last volume models hatched on this platform is the next 5-series, due in late 2023. So, what of that electric M5 we keep hearing so much about? Although an electric i5 is definitely in the offing (see box, below), packaging constraints and the absence of radically more capable batteries practically rule out the projected i5M, which has been pushed back. Instead there is talk of an M5 Performance model sharing its 750bhp power-hybrid drivetrain with project Rockstar, the X8 M hyper-SUV which is said to boast two e-motors in addition to its awesome V8.
One rung below, insiders claim that the first BMW to benefit from the new N-Car matrix – the 2025 platform that’s prompted Oliver Zipse’s Neue Klasse analogy – is the next 3-series, due in 2025. And there’s a certain symmetry to BMW’s critical next phase being spearheaded by the current machine that most closely resembles those of the first Neue Klasse.
__________________
///M is art Artemis
Appreciate 4
F87EVO4004.00
Robin_NL8679.50
EXE462097.00
Frosty772.50
      05-12-2022, 08:48 PM   #40
BitchinManWheels
Lieutenant
BitchinManWheels's Avatar
United_States
344
Rep
573
Posts

 
Drives: Dinan M4, Z4, X5, Raptor
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Shavertown, PA

iTrader: (0)

Ok, to please the old and the new, for $600k, I want a mid engine homage to the 1M with DINAN 4.6L stroker S65 V8 with a 6 speed manual transition. Carbon fiber tub/frame/panels. Updated carbon fiber M4 GTS wheels. Weight around 3000lbs. Stock tires 275 front and 315/325 rear. Optional aero (go stealth 911R or all out Vette ZR1). Any colors are included, NO standard colors, all unique. Interior has a nice sound system. I know you want to hear the car but if there will be speakers then please make them not be shitty. Oh, and European f*uckin pick up!!
Is that too much to ask???
__________________
"When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting."
Appreciate 0
      05-12-2022, 11:38 PM   #41
x622
Forced Induction Connoisseur
x622's Avatar
925
Rep
706
Posts

 
Drives: 23 X5MC / 23 720s
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: AZ

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2023 Mclaren 720s  [0.00]
2005 Honda S2000  [0.00]
2008 BMW M3  [0.00]
2023 BMW X5MC  [0.00]
1964 Ford Mustang  [0.00]
1968 Pontiac GTO  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
Ok, to please the old and the new, for $600k, I want a mid engine homage to the 1M with DINAN 4.6L stroker S65 V8 with a 6 speed manual transition. Carbon fiber tub/frame/panels. Updated carbon fiber M4 GTS wheels. Weight around 3000lbs. Stock tires 275 front and 315/325 rear. Optional aero (go stealth 911R or all out Vette ZR1). Any colors are included, NO standard colors, all unique. Interior has a nice sound system. I know you want to hear the car but if there will be speakers then please make them not be shitty. Oh, and European f*uckin pick up!!
Is that too much to ask???
I'm in
__________________
Oy vey, look at all these shekels
Appreciate 0
      05-13-2022, 01:25 AM   #42
SANK_CH
Captain
SANK_CH's Avatar
Switzerland
311
Rep
788
Posts

 
Drives: A Number 4
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SANK_CH View Post
Thank you for your reply , It will be nice to see it in real. I was excepting the 3 wagon, until i saw this thread.

I had the ppl from BMW Finance services 2 weeks ago. Funnily they have already in their system the M4 GT/H!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
I'm checking, should know soon.

This is basically where my research falls flat: I don't know how a car will look, and I can't predict how a car will ultimately be named. It's possible in this specific case BMW intentionally used a temporary name during the development process.

Again, I hope to know soon if this is the same or a different car. Though for betting purposes I'd pick "same".
As I wrote in the Post CSL teaser, the employees at BMW Finance in Switzerland had already visuals of the GT/H mid march. As we were talking about the CSL, I asked about an GT/H, and he replied to me "yes we have a GT/H in our system, you are right. But the visual is very different from the CSL". Too bad BMW does only 50 units, too bad they are sold out, too bad i did not won the lottery.
Appreciate 1
F87EVO4004.00
      05-13-2022, 01:28 AM   #43
Jashan
Private
Jashan's Avatar
United_States
48
Rep
85
Posts

 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: California

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Some of these comments are hilarious people really think bmw will build the car around some of your specific suggestions lmao
__________________
IG: Jashanii
Appreciate 1
n55f151262.50
      05-13-2022, 02:28 AM   #44
solstice
Major General
5457
Rep
7,037
Posts

 
Drives: 2015 M3 6MT
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Seattle

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
H: References to Hommage, Homologation, and Hybrid have been used; all 3 would be accurate
Is the hommage a hybrid and still manage to be significantly ligther than the M4 CSL?

Some kind or KERS system or MHEV maybe? That’s how it manages to get to 600 hp from the CSL’s 540hp? I believe MHEVs with manuals do exist but in a track level performance car of this magnitude, must be the first!?

Last edited by solstice; 05-13-2022 at 02:35 AM..
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:24 AM.




5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST