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      03-27-2019, 06:46 AM   #6469
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      03-27-2019, 06:58 AM   #6470
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      03-27-2019, 07:19 AM   #6471
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      03-27-2019, 07:40 AM   #6472
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      03-27-2019, 07:46 AM   #6473
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Itís a meme, and I get it, but Iím for being better than this.
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      03-27-2019, 07:48 AM   #6474
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Everyone wants equality let's give them it. Women too.
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      03-27-2019, 07:52 AM   #6475
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It’s a meme, and I get it, but I’m for being better than this.
It's about asking our Muslim Brothers to treat Christians right in their home countries.
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      03-27-2019, 08:57 AM   #6476
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Itís a meme, and I get it, but Iím for being better than this.
And you live in a country that allows you to be.
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      03-27-2019, 09:00 AM   #6477
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      03-27-2019, 09:05 AM   #6478
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privilege
It's ok, the outrage is far greater than the support.

Hopefully the momentum of this type of nonsense continues.

2020 here we come!

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      03-27-2019, 10:45 AM   #6479
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Weird. Almost as if it won't work.....
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      03-27-2019, 10:57 AM   #6480
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..
so Khrushchev wasn't so dumb after all. notice how he recognizes that when it finally evolves into a communist state, the United States will have been destroyed.
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      03-27-2019, 11:01 AM   #6481
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Weird. Almost as if it won't work.....
His message is partially spot on - the cost differential is crazy and is what needs to be addressed. And it all isn't the private insurance admin costs. It's whiz bang technology, lawsuits, doctors doing unneeded steps to try to avoid lawsuits and more.

His solution is bs pandering to get votes.
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      03-27-2019, 11:07 AM   #6482
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doctors doing unneeded steps to try to avoid lawsuits and more.
THIS

IT was 2 decades ago. Took my youngest son to ER for whooping cough (wife's desire, not mine, he sounded HORRIBLE but wasn't in any real distress)

AFTER they had administered treatment in the form of ventilation and inhaled cortico-steroids along with an antibiotic, THEN they came back an hour+ later wanting to draw blood from a toddler. They couldn't find his vein. I had to lay across my son trying to calm him, tears in both our eyes as he was depending on ME to protect him from harm, and I FAILED.

Yes, it's still a very sore spot in my fatherhood
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      03-27-2019, 11:42 AM   #6483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gjm120 View Post
His message is partially spot on - the cost differential is crazy and is what needs to be addressed. And it all isn't the private insurance admin costs. It's whiz bang technology, lawsuits, doctors doing unneeded steps to try to avoid lawsuits and more.

His solution is bs pandering to get votes.
If you’re a Finnish resident the cost is mostly paid by your locality (taxes) so you don’t see much. If you’re an EU resident similar. For a non-EU resident, say an American who goes to Finland to have her baby, the cost is about $8,500 Euros, or roughly $9,500 USD. This according to a little google searching this morning.

Seems the majority, if not all, of the “cost” difference is in how it is paid - really a price difference as the costs are probably quite comparable. We see a retail price, paid in part by insurance usually, with the copay and such remaining. Finns see a lower price because they’ve already paid in their taxes. This implies nothing about the quality or timeliness of care in either system, just how transparent costs are and how they are paid.

With respect to the thread, I apologize for not finding a meme to illustrate this.
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      03-27-2019, 12:01 PM   #6484
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Originally Posted by 2000cs View Post
If youíre a Finnish resident the cost is mostly paid by your locality (taxes) so you donít see much. If youíre an EU resident similar. For a non-EU resident, say an American who goes to Finland to have her baby, the cost is about $8,500 Euros, or roughly $9,500 USD. This according to a little google searching this morning.

Seems the majority, if not all, of the ďcostĒ difference is in how it is paid - really a price difference as the costs are probably quite comparable. We see a retail price, paid in part by insurance usually, with the copay and such remaining. Finns see a lower price because theyíve already paid in their taxes. This implies nothing about the quality or timeliness of care in either system, just how transparent costs are and how they are paid.

With respect to the thread, I apologize for not finding a meme to illustrate this.

I once pulled stats on mortality and health care per individual by country. The US spent the most and had shorter life expectancy than most developed countries. Doesn't help we have an obesity problem and mostly eat terrible, but....
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      03-27-2019, 12:09 PM   #6485
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
THIS

IT was 2 decades ago. Took my youngest son to ER for whooping cough (wife's desire, not mine, he sounded HORRIBLE but wasn't in any real distress)

AFTER they had administered treatment in the form of ventilation and inhaled cortico-steroids along with an antibiotic, THEN they came back an hour+ later wanting to draw blood from a toddler. They couldn't find his vein. I had to lay across my son trying to calm him, tears in both our eyes as he was depending on ME to protect him from harm, and I FAILED.

Yes, it's still a very sore spot in my fatherhood
About 3 years ago I had a cut over the eye that needed sewing up and went to the ER. Because it was the result of a head to head collision they wanted to take a scan of some sort. So I had a scan by this machine that must have cost a lot of money. The gross bill for the scan was around $2200 my out-of-pocket was something like $500+. The sutures were cheap. Point is, they felt the need to do the scan and in fairness wasn't probably all just covering themselves. The scan machine wasn't being used much which is inefficient. So the alternative is to have say one machine to service multiple locations. But then I would have to have traveled which since the doctors were afraid of head injury they would not want me to drive. I bet there are quite a few of these sort of conundrums with all the good technology we have but it costs.
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      03-27-2019, 01:43 PM   #6486
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gjm120 View Post
About 3 years ago I had a cut over the eye that needed sewing up and went to the ER. Because it was the result of a head to head collision they wanted to take a scan of some sort. So I had a scan by this machine that must have cost a lot of money. The gross bill for the scan was around $2200 my out-of-pocket was something like $500+. The sutures were cheap. Point is, they felt the need to do the scan and in fairness wasn't probably all just covering themselves. The scan machine wasn't being used much which is inefficient. So the alternative is to have say one machine to service multiple locations. But then I would have to have traveled which since the doctors were afraid of head injury they would not want me to drive. I bet there are quite a few of these sort of conundrums with all the good technology we have but it costs.
But, at least in the case above that I posted, they had already treated my son, he was breathing much better, and THEN they wanted to draw blood to confirm the diagnosis of bacterial infection. It's much more difficult to think at 03-something in the morning, I SHOULD have refused the "treatment"

Now, if you'd already been stitched up, your pupils weren't wildly/unevenly dilated, . . . <insert concussion protocol> and THEN they still wanted to scan your head, should they? That is what we need a DR. to decide is or isn't MEDICALLY necessary. Instead, it seems these days, the decision it whether it is LITIGIOUSLY necessary
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      03-27-2019, 01:46 PM   #6487
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      03-27-2019, 01:47 PM   #6488
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      03-27-2019, 01:51 PM   #6489
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
But, at least in the case above that I posted, they had already treated my son, he was breathing much better, and THEN they wanted to draw blood to confirm the diagnosis of bacterial infection. It's much more difficult to think at 03-something in the morning, I SHOULD have refused the "treatment"

Now, if you'd already been stitched up, your pupils weren't wildly/unevenly dilated, . . . <insert concussion protocol> and THEN they still wanted to scan your head, should they? That is what we need a DR. to decide is or isn't MEDICALLY necessary. Instead, it seems these days, the decision it whether it is LITIGIOUSLY necessary
Yep. There is a wanting to be sure b/c they are conscientious and wanting to be sure so they can defend a lawsuit. The two can get blurry and who knows the motivation. If I had thought about it I would have asked what the scan cost & quizzed them on the necessity. Already had been sitting around too long so wasn't thinking much.
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Last edited by gjm120; 03-27-2019 at 01:51 PM.. Reason: correction
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      03-27-2019, 01:52 PM   #6490
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wasn't thinking much.
See, you DID need it
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