EVO - Greatest ever ///M-Car

[Steved]

The magazine has landed on doormats this morning and the conclusions presented. I am sure it will provide plenty of debate as to whether the right car won, as well as where the E92 M3 fits within the greats.

Here's a few pics for now, but will be back on line to discuss later.

[MI6]

Originally Posted by Steved

The magazine has landed on doormats this morning and the conclusions presented. I am sure it will provide plenty of debate as to whether the right car won, as well as where the E92 M3 fits within the greats.

Here's a few pics for now, but will be back on line to discuss later.

Nice pics!

So................which is your fav Steved?

[Steved]

I came away from the test concluding that I already owned the best M-car. The CSL is a very hard act to follow, as BMW have already found that it's very hard to follow on from the E30 M3. Hopefully BMW will manage to do so with the E92 CSL.

The E92 M3 when compared in such illustrious company came out as being a great car, but not the greatest M-car.

[m_bazeepaymon]

damn...
btw i dont see the e92 m3 in any of the pics lol
unless its that late and I am blind

[DonM3]

Its in the first pic right at the back

Originally Posted by m_bazeepaymon

damn...
btw i dont see the e92 m3 in any of the pics lol
unless its that late and I am blind

[ILC32]

Originally Posted by Steved

I came away from the test concluding that I already owned the best M-car. The CSL is a very hard act to follow, as BMW have already found that it's very hard to follow on from the E30 M3. Hopefully BMW will manage to do so with the E92 CSL.

The E92 M3 when compared in such illustrious company came out as being a great car, but not the greatest M-car.

It's hard to be surprised at this result.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...1&postcount=32

In my opinion, I own the greatest M car ever!

[888]

Originally Posted by 888

1st E30 M3
2nd E46 CSL
3rd Z4 M coupe
4th E92 M3

M1 wild card??

How close was I??? More info PLZ. thanks for the pics.

[JEllis]

If the E30 M3 didnt get the greatest M car of all time then something is wrong.

Jason

[Epacy]

These teasers hurt! Anyone got scans?

[Steved]

Originally Posted by 888

How close was I??? More info PLZ. thanks for the pics.

1st place was given to the E30 M3 EVO, 2nd to the M3 CSL and 3rd to the E39 M5. The M1 made the final 4 (out of 13) ahead of all the modern M-cars.

The E92 M3 was then compared with the Top-4 to see how it fared, however it was concluded that whilst a great BMW, it was not as great an M-car as the Top-3. These are icons and the E92 M3 would need to raise its game a little further to achieve the same status.

We did feel though that the E92 M3 was the best modern day M-car, way ahead of the M5 and M6.

If you ask me what's missing in the E92 M3, I would have to say it was 'driver involvement' that marked it down. I personally found it a great deal of fun, but when compared to something like the E46 M3 CSL or E30 M3 EVO it is far too remote.

Clearly it does provide a far better balance between daily driver and sports car than either of those two.

A couple of sentences from the text when comparing M3 CSL with E92 M3; "Apart from anything else, it looks the absolute nuts, a drum-taut, hard-muscled object lesson in aesthetic warfare against which the E92 M3 comes across about as tough as a platoon of jelly babies. Sounds awesome too,"

Then a few more when concluding about why the E30 M3 won; "...it's the E30 that beats them all. It wins because it does more with less and destroys the idea (apparently at the core of BMW M thinking these days) that if power is good, more power must be better. If that were the case the E92 M3 - which on paper is a best-of-all-worlds solution, with its old-school M5-esque V8, M3 size and supercar pace - would represent the very pinnacle of the M Division's achievements. But the touch of the master belongs to a different era."

[Epacy]

Originally Posted by Steved

We did feel though that the E92 M3 was the best modern day M-car, way ahead of the M5 and M6.

Can you elaborate anymore on this topic?

[Steved]

Originally Posted by Epacy

Can you elaborate anymore on this topic?

Both M5 and M6 feel remote and lack interaction, they are fast but there's very little fun to be had driving them. I drove the M6 during this test for a few hundred miles and was bored and had little wish to drive it again. The SMG system is slower than SMG2 in my CSL and does not allow the driver to blip the throttle on downchanges. You struggle to boot it sideways out of a junction, since the torque just isn't delivered strongly until higher up the rev range. It all feels very undriver centric when compared with other M-cars.

The E92 M3 on the other hand feels like it is cut from the same block as the iconic M-cars, however it still relies a little too much on technology and compared to the greats, there still feels like there is a layer of tech in between driver and the road. Maybe that's progress, but I would really like to drive an E92 M3 without EDC and kept as simple in spec as possibe, since I suspect that might be the best way to have it.

So the E92 M3 is close to being great and could easily become one of the greats in a less-GT, more driver focused version.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Steved

Maybe that's progress, but I would really like to drive an E92 M3 without EDC and kept as simple in spec as possibe,

Thanks for the impressions. I take it that you have not had a chance to do the above? Have you heard anything from BMW about what the non-EDC suspension setup will be like?

[Steved]

Originally Posted by lucid

Thanks for the impressions. I take it that you have not had a chance to do the above? Have you heard anything from BMW about what the non-EDC suspension setup will be like?

Not yet, but I am aware of several customers who have specced their cars without EDC, so will be looking to gather their impressions in the near future. All the press/demo cars however have been built 'with' EDC.

[888]

Thanks for all the reports steved.

From what I read will I be wrong in assuming that for the average enthusiast the new M is 100% perfect?? As an enthusiast but not a very good driver I was never happy with my M coupe and I preferred the comfort of a regular M3 over the CSL. I have driven the new M3 and from my limited time behind the wheel I must say I am very happy.

[888]

Originally Posted by lucid

Thanks for the impressions. I take it that you have not had a chance to do the above? Have you heard anything from BMW about what the non-EDC suspension setup will be like?

BMW has stated that no EDC and 18” is the purist option.

[Steved]

Originally Posted by 888

Thanks for all the reports steved.

From what I read will I be wrong in assuming that for the average enthusiast the new M is 100% perfect?? As an enthusiast but not a very good driver I was never happy with my M coupe and I preferred the comfort of a regular M3 over the CSL. I have driven the new M3 and from my limited time behind the wheel I must say I am very happy.

I would agree with that. Some people have driven the new M3 and were dissapointed to find it was not a monster, whilst others have driven it and said it was 'everything' they always wanted in an M-car. I think its a better all round M-car than the E46 M3, and would certainly have chosen the E92 M3 rather than the E46 M3 CS that we also drove in comparison.

[Leg]

Originally Posted by Steved

For some reason that pic made me think of Spartacus.

Im the M car, no Im the M car, no Im the M car......

[JEllis]

Sounds like a good article. The E30 M3 I think was going to be the clear winner. The E30 M3 shold win considering that it was the car that started mass production of M cars and even in its road form was still very close to the race versions.

However, I am little surprsied the E39 M3 made 3rd and I downright shocked the M1 even made it into the top 5.

I read one article where the journalist actually drove his E39 M5 to the review and found the E92 M3 was everything the E39 M was, with a V8 and loads of power, except without the heavy feeling and lack of crispness.

The M1 is very shocking for multiple reasons. The first and biggest for me being that the car is more Lambo and Lotus than BMW. In fact the chasis was even built by Lambo for several years. Maybe the article brings this up but I personally have never considered the M1 to be a great example of BMW engineering since there is very little BMW in the car.

Jason

[JerezBlue!]

Originally Posted by Steved

Both M5 and M6 feel remote and lack interaction, they are fast but there's very little fun to be had driving them. I drove the M6 during this test for a few hundred miles and was bored and had little wish to drive it again. The SMG system is slower than SMG2 in my CSL and does not allow the driver to blip the throttle on downchanges. You struggle to boot it sideways out of a junction, since the torque just isn't delivered strongly until higher up the rev range. It all feels very undriver centric when compared with other M-cars.

The E92 M3 on the other hand feels like it is cut from the same block as the iconic M-cars, however it still relies a little too much on technology and compared to the greats, there still feels like there is a layer of tech in between driver and the road. Maybe that's progress, but I would really like to drive an E92 M3 without EDC and kept as simple in spec as possibe, since I suspect that might be the best way to have it.

So the E92 M3 is close to being great and could easily become one of the greats in a less-GT, more driver focused version.

Before this incarnation, I had never considered M3 'cause it was always a very raw driving experience (not like a GT).

So instead, I went for the Audi S4 2.7T followed by the Audi S4 4.2; both relatively more comfortable than the M3 of the day.

Then the most recent Audi RS4 4.2 came on the scene. Had it for a day and actually felt quite knackered by the end of it.

So, instead put down an M3 deposit and, having driven the car, kept my order and am looking forward to delivery in a few weeks.

IMO, I think there will be a whole bunch of buyers who will move to the E92 M3 for the very reason that it will be a great GT. No bad thing!

Cheers.

[Epacy]

Originally Posted by Steved

Both M5 and M6 feel remote and lack interaction, they are fast but there's very little fun to be had driving them. I drove the M6 during this test for a few hundred miles and was bored and had little wish to drive it again. The SMG system is slower than SMG2 in my CSL and does not allow the driver to blip the throttle on downchanges. You struggle to boot it sideways out of a junction, since the torque just isn't delivered strongly until higher up the rev range. It all feels very undriver centric when compared with other M-cars.

The E92 M3 on the other hand feels like it is cut from the same block as the iconic M-cars, however it still relies a little too much on technology and compared to the greats, there still feels like there is a layer of tech in between driver and the road. Maybe that's progress, but I would really like to drive an E92 M3 without EDC and kept as simple in spec as possibe, since I suspect that might be the best way to have it.

So the E92 M3 is close to being great and could easily become one of the greats in a less-GT, more driver focused version.

Thanks Steve.

[2002 Tii]

Originally Posted by JEllis

If the E30 M3 didnt get the greatest M car of all time then something is wrong.

Jason

Agreed, in terms of style, engineering and performance the car along with 2.3-16 valve mercedes took sports sedans to another level, E30-M3 dominated rally and road racing for years. The M635 was way ahead of its competion also, not to mention the M1 that put BMW in the all time list of the greatest exotic cars ever. The new M3 is a great car, but the greatest M car ever, no way.