2020-202x Toyota Supra

[duder13]

Originally Posted by OkieSnuffBox

That's why I said the "under-35 crowd" are the ones complaining.

It's not like it's the first time manufacturers have used another engine or had developing it.

Yamaha and the SHO V6, Porsche and the Harley VROD, Lotus using Toyota engines, etc, etc.

Sure, brands like Lotus use a Toyota engine...heck, even the McLaren F1 used a BMW engine, but the entire underpinnings of the Supra are BMW, which is quite a bit different.

[super51fan]

Originally Posted by duder13

I don't understand why you keeping bringing up the RC-F Track edition. It's more expensive because of "adding lightness" through things like carbon fiber and lighter components. I'm just talking about lopping half a foot off the RC-F chassis, like BMW has done in the past, and those cars ended up being cheaper than the larger cars. Plus, specialty cars like the Track Edition usually have considerable profit margins compared to regular versions.

The RC was developed by using many other chassis's and still came out to the same weight as the longer GS. Here we have a Lexus chassis that was developed yet no weight was able to be saved from.

I bring up the RC-F track edition because it is the lightweight version of that. Of course CF had to be used because if weight savings were cheap/easy at this point to save weight then they would have done it when initially developing the RC chassis to begin with.

You say they could just cut a foot off and save weight but that did not save weight when creating the RC initially so how would it work here?

Yes specialty cars do have a larger profit margin but that is because the economies of scale of a specialty model allow them to do. The RC-F Track Edition would be way more expensive if it didn't share most of the interiors, exteriors, drivetrains, and suspensions with the RC and RC-F models. The M4 GTS would be way more expensive if it didn't share most of the interiors, exteriors, drivetrains, and suspensions with the 4 series and M4 models. How does this work with the Supra since it doesn't have a base car to build off of? This is why the GTR is so much more money than the Skyline GTRs were of old (after adjusting for inflation obviously), they no longer have the base Skyline models to build off of.

And yeah 1 series cars were cheaper than 3 series models because it does not make business sense to price the lower model higher

[See5]

Originally Posted by duder13

I don't understand why you keeping bringing up the RC-F Track edition. It's more expensive because of "adding lightness" through things like carbon fiber and lighter components. I'm just talking about lopping half a foot off the RC-F chassis, like BMW has done in the past, and those cars ended up being cheaper than the larger cars. Plus, specialty cars like the Track Edition usually have considerable profit margins compared to regular versions.

You can't shorten/extend platforms just because you want to. They have set hardpoints, set wheelbase range, etc. that limit their flexibility.

If you want to sportscar, best to build a purpose built sportscar chassis. A shortened sedan chassis isn't going to cut it as its built to handle much heavier weight and size requirements.

The Nissan 350/370's are great examples of this. Just a compromised car. A 370Z weighs the same as a Corvette C6(similar time frame for comparison) with far less power, equipment, and a much smaller footprint. The S2000 was much lighter despite being around the same size as well.

A shortened RC chassis, still has a good chance of being way overweight as its already been modified and ended up too heavy as it is.

[supra93]

Numbers for August are in. 643 Supras were sold.

https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-...st-2019-sales/

[XutvJet]

Does the B58 sit more upright in the Supra compared to most BMWs? I was a bit perplexed to see a recent YouTuber showing his turbo swap Supra and he yanked the airbox and the turbo was easily accessible. On my M235, the N55 leans way over and I can't even see the turbo from the top. The B58 M240s are the same way.

I REALLY wish the styling of the Supra wasn't so over the top. It's dialed up to 11 whereas an 8 would do. Too many fake vents, fins, foils, and a wonky nose. Otherwise, the shape is nice and overall, it's pretty damn killer car. Perhaps I'll change my mind when I see one in person.

[86Zed]

I keep hearing positive opinions of the cars in-person aesthetics and presence, especially in yellow.

Tada insisting the MT enthusiasts should try the AT and be won over by its evolution and ever improving tech is bogus. There is absolutely a market and stubborn customer base that will accept nothing short of MT for a weekend (or daily) car. Let's hope its coming in one of the future variants ($$)

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

Does the B58 sit more upright in the Supra compared to most BMWs? I was a bit perplexed to see a recent YouTuber showing his turbo swap Supra and he yanked the airbox and the turbo was easily accessible. On my M235, the N55 leans way over and I can't even see the turbo from the top. The B58 M240s are the same way.

I REALLY wish the styling of the Supra wasn't so over the top. It's dialed up to 11 whereas an 8 would do. Too many fake vents, fins, foils, and a wonky nose. Otherwise, the shape is nice and overall, it's pretty damn killer car. Perhaps I'll change my mind when I see one in person.

Same 30° angle as any relatively recent BMW straight six. Remember, this car is a BMW chassis with a BMW engine assembled at a BMW plant.

[spiceyxi]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I REALLY wish the styling of the Supra wasn't so over the top. It's dialed up to 11 whereas an 8 would do. Too many fake vents, fins, foils, and a wonky nose. Otherwise, the shape is nice and overall, it's pretty damn killer car. Perhaps I'll change my mind when I see one in person.

I looked at a local launch edition and was surprised by all of the fake vents. I knew it going in, but to see it in person was disappointing. Even more so than the fake vents on the side of the M2. I am still interested in driving one, but don't see myself pulling the trigger.

[super51fan]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I REALLY wish the styling of the Supra wasn't so over the top. It's dialed up to 11 whereas an 8 would do. Too many fake vents, fins, foils, and a wonky nose. Otherwise, the shape is nice and overall, it's pretty damn killer car. Perhaps I'll change my mind when I see one in person.

In person the shape is very aggressive where the rest is toned down to result in a muscular shape. The fake vents are truly blown out of proportion, yeah they are fake but you don't notice them unless you're looking for them. The nose is still fugly though and they should have made the mouth wider instead of matching the FT1

[pikkagtr]

I disagree on not noticing the fake vents
Everytime you'd open your driver door you'd have to look at the largest fake vent on the body next to the handle

[New2Roundel]

Originally Posted by duder13

Sure, brands like Lotus use a Toyota engine...heck, even the McLaren F1 used a BMW engine, but the entire underpinnings of the Supra are BMW, which is quite a bit different.

This guy gets it. The supra is essentially the Asian version of the crossfire. It's nothing like the other guy was saying.

Originally Posted by See5

The Nissan 350/370's are great examples of this. Just a compromised car. A 370Z weighs the same as a Corvette C6(similar time frame for comparison) with far less power, equipment, and a much smaller footprint. The S2000 was much lighter despite being around the same size as well.

Another silly comparison. The Corvette is a more expensive car all the way around, so of course it's going to be a more of a performance car. Clearly though, Asian companies do not really see the value in supporting performance car as they do any other vehicle they make. Toyota went to another brand to make their car and Nissan decided to make one platform/powertrain and keep it the same for over a decade. Honda is the exception here, but the NSX isn't exactly cheap. But I respect Honda much more for their attempt with the NSX than their Asian competitors, which should be ashamed of themselves.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Same 30° angle as any relatively recent BMW straight six. Remember, this car is a BMW chassis with a BMW engine assembled at a BMW plant.

That's what I figured, but if you watch this video (look at the 7 minute mark), the turbo and EWG is easily serviceable/replaceable compared to any turbo I6 BMW I've ever seen. Most every other turbo swap requires you to yank engine mounts, lift the engine slightly, and have some creative movements to get the turbo out the bottom. I suppose the revised B58 without exterior exhaust manifold is freeing up a lot of space and makes things FAR more accessible from the top. That alone should make turbo swaps very common on these cars.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by pikkagtr

I disagree on not noticing the fake vents
Everytime you'd open your driver door you'd have to look at the largest fake vent on the body next to the handle

If I got one, I'd body color paint/wrap for the hood vents and develop body colored piece that fits into the fake door vent to make it blend in with the fender. I'd then body color paint/wrap the front and rear lower valence black winglets (wish they weren't there) and the black portion in the lower front bumper.

The Japanese had such organic and elegant designs back in the 1990s and early 2000s. The new Supra got close, but it's like they just couldn't quite resist. Kind of like American designs where they can't let go of pedestal rear spoilers and chrome wheels.

[spiceyxi]

Originally Posted by super51fan

In person the shape is very aggressive where the rest is toned down to result in a muscular shape. The fake vents are truly blown out of proportion, yeah they are fake but you don't notice them unless you're looking for them. The nose is still fugly though and they should have made the mouth wider instead of matching the FT1

[QUOTE=super51fan;25216285]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

In person the shape is very aggressive where the rest is toned down to result in a muscular shape. The fake vents are truly blown out of proportion, yeah they are fake but you don't notice them unless you're looking for them. The nose is still fugly though and they should have made the mouth wider instead of matching the FT1

I would notice all of the fake vents Everytime I would walk to the car.

Z4 coupe photo for fun in there.
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[supra93]

New review + interview.

[3GFX]

Buddy of mine has owned it for a little while. Couple of things they didn't like at the shop...

[N54Yankee]

Didn’t know the vents were fake. That’s cheesy especially in this day.

[bobowar135]

Originally Posted by supra93

New review + interview.

@ 2.05 if this was built as a drivers car it would feature a manual transmission.

[super51fan]

Originally Posted by bobowar135

@ 2.05 if this was built as a drivers car it would feature a manual transmission.

Thats some air tight logic there bud

[3GFX]

Originally Posted by 3GFX

Buddy of mine has owned it for a little while. Couple of things they didn't like at the shop...

Originally Posted by N54Yankee

Didn’t know the vents were fake. That’s cheesy especially in this day.

Its weird that they did this. They claim its so the aftermarket can remove them?

[super51fan]

Originally Posted by N54Yankee

Didn’t know the vents were fake. That’s cheesy especially in this day.

My guess is future models will have them uncapped like the GT4 car. As for the door one, that piece is removable to allow easier wide body models (you only need to replace the door vent instead of the entire door to blend into the quarter panel) like the GR racing concept shown at geneva 2018

[supra93]

On top of my head the Honda CTR and Audi R8 also have a number of fake vents. I'm sure there are a bunch more to list if I had time to look it up.