Horner in trouble at Red Bull

[Autobacs]

Originally Posted by Sneaky Pete

In life honesty should be appreciated, I'm a big fan, though it gets me into trouble a bit too often.

In the corporate world though it appears to be not so much appreciated.
After his second go at McLaren where he mercilessly criticised Honda, he was no longer top of the list for a front running F1 seat...the feeling being that despite his massive abilities he just too much of a loose cannon
His foray into racing in the USA didn't go so well either as Honda were still grumpy with him and did their best to keep him out of any team using their engines.

True that. All the more reason I appreciate him as he knows the consequences but he chooses to be himself and does not regret it.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

He behaved awkward during the FIA 2022 awards ceremony.

From 00:38 onwards:

what is stranger is, that alcohol is 100% forbidden in his religion ...

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Yeah ....What a mess !

It was a perfectly reasonable decision by FIA to investigate the suspected Toto/Suzie COI, it would happen to anyone suspected of this by them and the investigation 'cleared' them, I think she's overreacting in suing FIA with some kind of a revenge reaction.
Horner was cleared of the coarsely jocular accusation against him and has no qualms about using revenge on anyone.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

It was a perfectly reasonable decision by FIA to investigate the suspected Toto/Suzie COI, it would happen to anyone suspected of this by them and the investigation 'cleared' them, I think she's overreacting in suing FIA with some kind of a revenge reaction.
Horner was cleared of the coarsely jocular accusation against him and has no qualms about using revenge on anyone.

Imagine a worldwide organization releasing a statement saying that an investigation has been opened against you and your significant other, but with virtually no info, and two days later that organization back-pedals by stating that the investigation has ended with no further action.

How would you react ? Would you assume that some folks tried to screw you and to tarnish your reputation ? Wouldn't you be interested to know who was involved ?

Susie Wolff (Dec 2023): "However, this episode has so far taken place without transparency or accountability. I have received online abuse about my work and my family. I will not allow myself to be intimidated and intend to follow up until I have found out who has instigated this campaign and misled the media."

[garyfried]

I have not been on this forum for a few weeks and much to my dismay when I returned to day I found out that this is now now the Christan Horner Corner. It the first page of texts I did not see BMW mentioned once. If this is the direction that you old gossips wish to turn then I don't need to remain here.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by g21

what is stranger is, that alcohol is 100% forbidden in his religion ...

Please keep religion out of this - that's no-one's business here. It's simply the impression that he behaved awkward and that CEO Stefano Domenicali had to stop him.

Maybe no booze or prescriptive or recreational substance use were involved at all, but the individual simply demonstrating that he seems not being the sharpest tool in the shed.

But Jean-Marie Balestre, one of his illustrious predecessors, would say: "Hold my beer !"

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

I first got that feeling at brazil 2016, with Max driving those different lines in the rain, overtaking people like Rosberg on the outside (which is the motorsport equivalent of a nutmeg ), catching crazy drifts etc.
Senna of course was also a master of the rain.
Max already had a win and a few podiums that year, but Brazil was just crazy to watch.

Agreed, but to be honest, Ros was mediocre at best. What Max did in what wasn't even a competitive car was astonishing. To be winning, putting that car on the podium or top 4 when it should have at best been 8th is something only maybe a few F1 drivers in history could have done and certainly no one since Sch.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Imagine a worldwide organization releasing a statement saying that an investigation has been opened against you and your significant other, but with virtually no info, and two days later that organization back-pedals by stating that the investigation has ended with no further action.

How would you react ? Would you assume that some folks tried to screw you and to tarnish your reputation ? Wouldn't you be interested to know who was involved ?

Susie Wolff (Dec 2023): "However, this episode has so far taken place without transparency or accountability. I have received online abuse about my work and my family. I will not allow myself to be intimidated and intend to follow up until I have found out who has instigated this campaign and misled the media."

That's tough on Susie W and I wish her luck in finding what made FIA investigate them but imagine what Horners family has been through too, attacked from nearly all sides for what again? and after it all not holding any grudges being a team manager with the speculations and grudges apparently continuing from some.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Marcoose

Why it’s impossible to compare drivers across generations. H-pattern vs paddle shifter is just one. Engine, fuel, tyre, aerodynamics, size and weight of car, regulations, feeder series, budgets, travel, number of races, sizes of teams, onboard aids and controls, etc, etc, etc. Fangio and Verstappen would’ve struggled in each other’s times.

Max would do well in any type of car from any generation. He is one of the few guys (maybe the only guy) on the F1 grid who easily adapts and has the agility to drive a car that suits his preferential style and also one that doesnt. Plus when he races in the sim, he isnt racing the same car but varying categories.
On the other hand, you have Ham who cant drive for shit if the car isnt exactly to his liking and we are seeing how well he does when the team rebuilds the car scratch to suit his specific wants because they didnt listen to him in the prior 2 years - the car is more garbage now than it was in 2022 and 2023.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Autobacs

Alonso's mouth is by no means a handicap and is an asset to F1. F1 would be boring without Alonso's brash honesty.

I don't doubt one bit that Max is not the least worried about having a team mate who might be faster. I think Hamilton was when Nico retired, thus Bottas.

Alo is a solid driver but has def made some bad decisions and generally seems to have been toxic to teams in the past.

Ham was threatened by Max's talent early on. He knew if Ros could beat him that Max would for sure since Ros was never actually that good.
Max isnt worried about anyone being faster because there isnt a faster driver on the grid. It's funny that people talk about Lec being fast over 1 lap, but Max has ~50% more poles and knowing he doesnt set his car up for quali (when Lec does) but for the race tells you his ability to extract everything in quali in a suboptimal set-up is supreme. And we all know there isnt a driver as fast in a race, or one who manages tires better or is as consistent as Max lap after lap.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Max would do well in any type of car from any generation. He is one of the few guys (maybe the only guy) on the F1 grid who easily adapts and has the agility to drive a car that suits his preferential style and also one that doesnt. Plus when he races in the sim, he isnt racing the same car but varying categories.

No other former or current F1 driver can beat Verstappen at sim racing. He's generally considered one of the best sim drivers worldwide. It's generally known that he sometimes goes sim racing only a couple of hours after having raced real-world F1 qualies or a real-world F1 race. Most F1 drivers take it easy after qualies or a race, while he competes in more qualies or yet another race, albeit in the virtual world.

Also his versatility is intriguing: in sim racing he prefers racing GT cars, LMP2 cars and F3 cars instead of a Red Bull F1 car. All those different driving styles and techniques and endurance racing may also improve his real world F1 driving skills and prepare him for a future real-world Le Mans career after he retires from F1 after a possible 8th WDC.

Sep 2015 video here | 05:23 - 05:30:
Question: What do you want to ask your future self in 2030 ?
[Wat wil je vragen aan je toekomstige zelf in 2030 ?]
Verstappen (17 yrs): Have I become world champion more than seven times ?
[Ben ik méér dan zeven keer wereldkampioen geworden ?]

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by garyfried

I have not been on this forum for a few weeks and much to my dismay when I returned to day I found out that this is now now the Christan Horner Corner. It the first page of texts I did not see BMW mentioned once. If this is the direction that you old gossips wish to turn then I don't need to remain here.

Thread location and thread title:
BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > Professional Motorsport Racing Discussion (IMSA, DTM, Formula 1, Grand-AM, Le Mans, IRL, WRC, etc..) > Horner in trouble at RedBull

You visit a big shopping mall and you decide to enter a lingerie shop. Are you genuinely surprised to see, much to your dismay, lingerie everywhere inside that shop and that you hear, equally much to your dismay, folks over there mainly talk and gossip about lingerie (especially when something about lingerie is making headlines worldwide) ?

If you want to discuss BMW in professional motorsport racing, feel free to create a new thread or to participate in existing dedicated threads dealing with the topics of your preference.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Artemis

No other former or current F1 driver can beat Verstappen at sim racing. He's generally considered one of the best sim drivers worldwide. It's generally known that he sometimes goes sim racing only a couple of hours after having raced real-world F1 qualies or a real-world F1 race. Most F1 drivers take it easy after qualies or a race, while he competes in more qualies or yet another race, albeit in the virtual world.

Also his versatility is intriguing: in sim racing he prefers racing GT cars, LMP2 cars and F3 cars instead of a Red Bull F1 car. All those different driving styles and techniques and endurance racing may also improve his real world F1 driving skills and prepare him for a future real-world Le Mans career after he retires from F1 after a possible 8th WDC.

Sep 2015 video here | 05:23 - 05:30:
Question: What do you want to ask your future self in 2030 ?
[Wat wil je vragen aan je toekomstige zelf in 2030 ?]
Verstappen (17 yrs): Have I become world champion more than seven times ?
[Ben ik méér dan zeven keer wereldkampioen geworden ?]

Sixth sense: A supposed intuitive faculty giving awareness not explicable in terms of normal perception

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Artemis

No other former or current F1 driver can beat Verstappen at sim racing. He's generally considered one of the best sim drivers worldwide. It's generally known that he sometimes goes sim racing only a couple of hours after having raced real-world F1 qualies or a real-world F1 race. Most F1 drivers take it easy after qualies or a race, while he competes in more qualies or yet another race, albeit in the virtual world.

Also his versatility is intriguing: in sim racing he prefers racing GT cars, LMP2 cars and F3 cars instead of a Red Bull F1 car. All those different driving styles and techniques and endurance racing may also improve his real world F1 driving skills and prepare him for a future real-world Le Mans career after he retires from F1 after a possible 8th WDC.

Sep 2015 video here | 05:23 - 05:30:
Question: What do you want to ask your future self in 2030 ?
[Wat wil je vragen aan je toekomstige zelf in 2030 ?]
Verstappen (17 yrs): Have I become world champion more than seven times ?
[Ben ik méér dan zeven keer wereldkampioen geworden ?]

Exactly - his talent goes beyond one and transcends motorsport categories. Plus it further shows when the cars are all equal his skill and talent simply stand above the rest.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Alo is a solid driver but has def made some bad decisions and generally seems to have been toxic to teams in the past.

Ham was threatened by Max's talent early on. He knew if Ros could beat him that Max would for sure since Ros was never actually that good.
Max isnt worried about anyone being faster because there isnt a faster driver on the grid. It's funny that people talk about Lec being fast over 1 lap, but Max has ~50% more poles and knowing he doesnt set his car up for quali (when Lec does) but for the race tells you his ability to extract everything in quali in a suboptimal set-up is supreme. And we all know there isnt a driver as fast in a race, or one who manages tires better or is as consistent as Max lap after lap.

As of yet, Charlie's car hasn't shown the pace to win a race. Why not set it up for poles and try to snatch a few. I would rather have a few poles than nothing at all.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

As of yet, Charlie's car hasn't shown the pace to win a race. Why not set it up for poles and try to snatch a few. I would rather have a few poles than nothing at all.

Dont disagree, but my point was more that even though his setup is strictly done for the race, while consciously sacrificing lap time in quali, he overwhelming beats Lec to pole when Lec is setup for precisely for quali pace. It is down to driving talent, and ability to take a race setup car and still beat the guy who specifically set his car up to win quali and only quali. Ultimately, Max is still the fastest guy over one lap or the race is how I see it.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Dont disagree, but my point was more that even though his setup is strictly done for the race, while consciously sacrificing lap time in quali, he overwhelming beats Lec to pole when Lec is setup for precisely for quali pace. It is down to driving talent, and ability to take a race setup car and still beat the guy who specifically set his car up to win quali and only quali. Ultimately, Max is still the fastest guy over one lap or the race is how I see it.

Oh, I get what you are saying. Yes, I think Max is slightly faster than Charlie. But, I still think he is completely capable of giving Max a lot more heartburn than people give him credit for. We will never know until Ferrari get their $hit together with a serious challenger. Which may never happen

Oh, forgot to add IMHO since some here feel my posts are "Utterly inventive" and can't be deemed credible

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

Oh, I get what you are saying. Yes, I think Max is slightly faster than Charlie. But, I still think he is completely capable of giving Max a lot more heartburn than people give him credit for. We will never know until Ferrari get their $hit together with a serious challenger. Which may never happen

Oh, forgot to add IMHO since some here feel my posts are "Utterly inventive" and can't be deemed credible

Nothing inventive if you ask me - but you are super open minded and realistic.

Yes, Lec is one of my favorite drivers aside from Max.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by Artemis

No other former or current F1 driver can beat Verstappen at sim racing. He's generally considered one of the best sim drivers worldwide.

That's because when he's actually racing he's not in a car in his mind, he's just processing information. Most drivers prefer the feel of the car underneath them, it's extra information, but Max just doesn't need that, it's all lines on a grid. He's closer to a digital medium in an analog space. He's an evolution.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Nothing inventive if you ask me - but you are super open minded and realistic.

Yes, Lec is one of my favorite drivers aside from Max.

I wouldn't go that far

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Sixth sense: A supposed intuitive faculty giving awareness not explicable in terms of normal perception

If MAX wins this weekend , It's a new F1 Record !
Last year he won 10 races in a row and if he wins this weekend , then he has won 10 races in a row (again)!

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

If MAX wins this weekend , It's a new F1 Record !
Last year he won 10 races in a row and if he wins this weekend , then he has won 10 races in a row (again)!

10 more reasons to be cheerful