California to Ban the Sale of New Gasoline Cars

[chris719]

Originally Posted by H2O_Doc

Again, we've know that certain gases warm the planet. We've known this for centuries. We expected that unabated fossil fuel combustion, which releases those gases and those gases can accumulate in the atmosphere, should by properties of physics warm the planet. The planet is warming as should be expected. For it not to be warming would be very odd.

Not a new idea. Lots of data. Ice cores give us data for hundreds of thousands of years ago. There is a ton of cross checking of data with very reliable proxies.

Don't you go bringing in facts . Comfortable contrarianism is much easier to sell than uncomfortable and complex truths.

[MunkyTool]

Originally Posted by NickyC

I’ll bow out of this thread now as anything else I’ll say will be rehashed bloviating that won’t change anyones mind.

I will say this though. I beg anyone who is still so swayed by the “science” to please keep in mind what has happened over the past 18 months. Any dissenting opinions concerning the COVID “vaccine” were cancelled, kicked off platforms, ridiculed, and absolutely beaten into submission by the government/media cabal pushing the “safe and effective” lie. Those same forces are now telling you they never said the “vaccine” would prevent transmission, nor injury, nor death. They were lying to us then and they’re lying to us now. Never forget who filled in skate parks with sand, didn’t allow you to see dying relatives, destroyed your small business while massive box stores remained open, and worst of all robbed you of your dignity over a virus that primarily targeted people past average life expectancy.

Science is dead, a narrative is being pushed and all dissenting views are crushed.

Please ask yourself what else are they lying about?

"I'm going to leave as everyone is just going to bloviate. But before I do, let me bloviate."

[NickyC]

Originally Posted by MunkyTool

"I'm going to leave as everyone is just going to bloviate. But before I do, let me bloviate."

Exactly, I love the word and use it any chance I get.

[Socal_R8]

something missed in most of this thread is that it won't be just Cali...

Most major car companies have vowed to be full EV by 2035 anyway.(Ford, GM, etc)

I believe the article (which was blacked out for subs only so couldn't read it) said
NEW car sales....So this is much to do about nothing since most automakers will be almost fully electric by 2035 anyways.


Hopefully we will will all be flying in drones by then anyways....

[T0RM3NT]

Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX

something missed in most of this thread is that it won't be just Cali...

Most major car companies have vowed to be full EV by 2035 anyway.(Ford, GM, etc)

I believe the article (which was blacked out for subs only so couldn't read it) said
NEW car sales....So this is much to do about nothing since most automakers will be almost fully electric by 2035 anyways.


Hopefully we will will all be flying in drones by then anyways....

Do a quick Google or YouTube search for Urban Air Mobility or UAM. Interesting stuff with an aggressive timeline.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_Air_Mobility

[chris719]

People, and cars, can't drive for shit in 2 dimensions and you want them to fly?

[Socal_R8]

Originally Posted by chris719

People, and cars, can't drive for shit in 2 dimensions and you want them to fly?

these will be all automated....punch in destination on the screen and it will do the rest.

I'm sure it will be much safer than road travel

[chris719]

Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX

these will be all automated....punch in destination on the screen and it will do the rest.

I'm sure it will be much safer than road travel

When everyone has one and the skies are clogged? They only work well autonomously because there's nothing to collide with. Once there are obstacles and bad weather, it becomes a hard problem. Every accident will basically be fatal.

[Socal_R8]

Originally Posted by chris719

When everyone has one and the skies are clogged? They only work well autonomously because there's nothing to collide with. Once there are obstacles and bad weather, it becomes a hard problem. Every accident will basically be fatal.

not at all....they will all have preprogrammed flight paths and collision avoidance systems and think about how much more room there is in the open sky compared to jamming everyone on a single path like a road does..

These are just in their infancy right now, but they will be the future....

[chris719]

Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX

not at all....they will all have preprogrammed flight paths and collision avoidance systems and think about how much more room there is in the open sky compared to jamming everyone on a single path like a road does..

These are just in their infancy right now, but they will be the future....

I admire your optimism, but I do not share it .

[T0RM3NT]

Originally Posted by SoCal_NSX

not at all....they will all have preprogrammed flight paths and collision avoidance systems and think about how much more room there is in the open sky compared to jamming everyone on a single path like a road does..

These are just in their infancy right now, but they will be the future....

https://spectrum.ieee.org/evtol-air-taxi-industry

[Equilibrandt]

Californian here. Love seeing threads like this devolve away from meaningful discussion because some of you ancient boomers always need to bring in politics and vaccinations. Disgusting (and embarrassing, really).

All I have to do is look at how fast charging infrastructure sprung up down here in SoCal to know that this is possible, whether we want it or not. Most manufacturers have already promised being a majority-EV by that same date. Nothing shocking here.

Just California trying to be the cutting edge.
> Publish some arbitrary date about banning ICEs and apply societal pressure
> Use said pressure to get automakers and charging infrastructure to accelerate their timelines
> Push back date and continue to apply pressure
> "Suddenly" we have the infrastructure to actually support a majority-EV state.

Down here in SoCal, I could already do 99.99% of my yearly work and leisure travel fully-EV. In 2022. Couple more turbines in cow country across the US and we'll be chillin'.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

Down here in SoCal, I could already do 99.99% of my yearly work and leisure travel fully-EV. In 2022. Couple more turbines in cow country across the US and we'll be chillin'.

Overall, even if it's not going to be clean or pretty in some areas, the reality is that setting a date helps drive the transition. I actually think this will be delayed in some areas because the problem is genuinely hard, but it's going to help everyone get their shit together at least because no one works until a deadline is imminent in this country.

[G MONEY]

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

Californian here. Love seeing threads like this devolve away from meaningful discussion because some of you ancient boomers always need to bring in politics and vaccinations. Disgusting (and embarrassing, really).

All I have to do is look at how fast charging infrastructure sprung up down here in SoCal to know that this is possible, whether we want it or not. Most manufacturers have already promised being a majority-EV by that same date. Nothing shocking here.

Just California trying to be the cutting edge.
> Publish some arbitrary date about banning ICEs and apply societal pressure
> Use said pressure to get automakers and charging infrastructure to accelerate their timelines
> Push back date and continue to apply pressure
> "Suddenly" we have the infrastructure to actually support a majority-EV state.

Down here in SoCal, I could already do 99.99% of my yearly work and leisure travel fully-EV. In 2022. Couple more turbines in cow country across the US and we'll be chillin'.

Look, I honestly don't care what anyone has to say about when the EV takeover happens. My opinion is not in my lifetime. Right or wrong, just my 2 cents. But I disagree with people who say " I'm good with EV now. I can go a hole week on 2 charges. Well good for you. But there are tens of millions who can't
Do that. Also, Ford and Chevy can say whatever. We are supposed to believe everything they spew out? Chevy has made a total cluster fuck of the Z06 launch but I'm supposed to believe they will have all there shit together on the EV front? Other than the Z06, Ford and Chevy can keep every other turd they put out.

[M4Tejas]

California. You reap what you sow. Gavin!

Don't give me shit man. I lived at VAFB four years and rode dirt bikes all around Minutemen III silos. You could see SLC6 from the front door of our trailer. I seen the "Hells Angels" take over 101 and Pismo Beach in 1968! Those fuckers scared the law back then.

[H2O_Doc]

Originally Posted by BMWTEJAS

California. You reap what you sow. Gavin!

Don't give me shit man. I lived at VAFB four years and rode dirt bikes all around Minutemen III silos. You could see SLC6 from the front door of our trailer. I seen the "Hells Angels" take over 101 and Pismo Beach in 1968! Those fuckers scared the law back then.

No kidding? I rode at VAFB. Down the push trail and then into that endless sea of California brush. Great days. That was an experience that people would have paid a fortune for.

[Alfisti]

I am politically agnostic and pro vaccine, I am a pragmatist. Charging is a monumental issue, it cannot be done in 13 yrs, it is impossible.

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

Californian here. Love seeing threads like this devolve away from meaningful discussion because some of you ancient boomers always need to bring in politics and vaccinations. Disgusting (and embarrassing, really).

All I have to do is look at how fast charging infrastructure sprung up down here in SoCal to know that this is possible, whether we want it or not. Most manufacturers have already promised being a majority-EV by that same date. Nothing shocking here.

Just California trying to be the cutting edge.
> Publish some arbitrary date about banning ICEs and apply societal pressure
> Use said pressure to get automakers and charging infrastructure to accelerate their timelines
> Push back date and continue to apply pressure
> "Suddenly" we have the infrastructure to actually support a majority-EV state.

Down here in SoCal, I could already do 99.99% of my yearly work and leisure travel fully-EV. In 2022. Couple more turbines in cow country across the US and we'll be chillin'.

[Equilibrandt]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I am politically agnostic and pro vaccine, I am a pragmatist. Charging is a monumental issue, it cannot be done in 13 yrs, it is impossible.

I rented up until 6 months ago. My main fear is (like everyone who previously commented) how renters and high-rise tenants will charge.

But to say 13 years is impossible is quite puzzling to me. I've seen an absolutely insane level of infrastructure set up in 2-3 years.

> A few of the lots at my workplace have chargers
> Every row at two of my local malls have two chargers
> I pass Hydrogen and EV Supercharge stations all the time.
> I drive from SoCal to Salt Lake, Utah and can point out each and every stop I'd need to stop to charge at.

We can all agree that stopping 3x on a 12 hour drive to charge for 45 minutes sucks vs a gasoline fill-up. I concur on us needing a quantum leap in battery tech to make it affordable (hoping the $25-35k range). I agree that we're burning coal to power the EVs and make the batteries.

But I definitely don't think that generation infrastructure (nuclear, turbines, photovoltaic) and charging infrastructure are the limiters in 13 year's time. Cash is king and with enough money, we'll be done way before then.

[M4Tejas]

Originally Posted by H2O_Doc

No kidding? I rode at VAFB. Down the push trail and then into that endless sea of California brush. Great days. That was an experience that people would have paid a fortune for.

I had a 125 and a 250 Yamaha. I had 100,000's of acres to ride on. I would put the brush over me and the dirt bike before MMIII missile launch. The choppers swept the area. I got too close. A bit of heat coming out of the hole. Scared the holyfauk out of my ass. Never again. Always from a distance. I went into the hole when this shit was "top secret". Hell now, you can view old school Minutemen III launch on youtube. Dad was responsible for over 250 launches the time we were there. Cold War. No games. All the GPS Sats were coming out of VAFB the time we lived there. 24 in geosync orbit. GPS was "top secret". I seen a few do "courier duty" with attaches handcuffed to their wrists. Probably "launch codes". Who knows?
I was pulling new electronics out of dumpsters on the base and building SW and AM/FM radios at age 14. Heathkit was my friend too.

Many experiences living the military life. Now Hahn AB after that. 45 minutes to Communist territory in an F4D. The Ring was new back then down the road. Yes, the RING. Nürburgring. Army General wanted a "field trip" They did an exercise at the Ring. Tents all over it. 1972.


edit - The Ring was not new but improved in 72.......built in the 1920s around the village and medieval castle of Nürburg in the Eifel mountains.

[H2O_Doc]

Originally Posted by BMWTEJAS

I had a 125 and a 250 Yamaha. I had 100,000's of acres to ride on. I would put the brush over me and the dirt bike before MMIII missile launch. The choppers swept the area. I got too close. A bit of heat coming out of the hole. Scared the holyfauk out of my ass. Never again. Always from a distance. I went into the hole when this shit was "top secret". Hell now, you can view old school Minutemen III launch on youtube. Dad was responsible for over 250 launches the time we were there. Cold War. No games. All the GPS Sats were coming out of VAFB the time we lived there. 24 in geosync orbit. GPS was "top secret". I seen a few do "courier duty" with attaches handcuffed to their wrists. Probably "launch codes". Who knows?
I was pulling new electronics out of dumpsters on the base and building SW and AM/FM radios at age 14. Heathkit was my friend too.

Many experiences living the military life. Now Hahn AB after that. 45 minutes to Communist territory in an F4D. The Ring was new back then down the road. Yes, the RING. Nürburgring. Army General wanted a "field trip" They did an exercise at the Ring. Tents all over it. 1972.

I had an RM250 at VAFB. Early 80s, back in the day when a guy like Bad Brad Lackey could still win a championship. It was a heck of a place to be a kid. And I think a big reason why I became a biologist.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

I rented up until 6 months ago. My main fear is (like everyone who previously commented) how renters and high-rise tenants will charge.

But to say 13 years is impossible is quite puzzling to me. I've seen an absolutely insane level of infrastructure set up in 2-3 years.

> A few of the lots at my workplace have chargers
> Every row at two of my local malls have two chargers
> I pass Hydrogen and EV Supercharge stations all the time.
> I drive from SoCal to Salt Lake, Utah and can point out each and every stop I'd need to stop to charge at.

Where in SoCal are you? Because despite living in the same region, I'm not seeing the abundance of chargers you claim outside of the occasional big box store parking lot. That goes for LA, OC, and the IE. Millions of people here are apartment dwelling and/or dependent on street parking. I don't see a feasible solution yet for them.

If California politicians really cared about the environment, the would have made light rail projects come to fruition. There's no reason we should be dependent on driving from one part of SoCal to the other in heavy traffic. There's no reason we should have to fly between LA<->SF or drive for 6+ hrs in either direction. Give people a reason to leave their cars at home or live a car-free lifestyle altogether.

But in reality their priorities are ideology and money. Gotta appease the automakers, the charging companies, and the entire EV supply chain. I have a pretty good hunch on what sorts of companies our politicians invest in.

And no I'm not anti-vax boomer, quite the opposite.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Equilibrandt

But I definitely don't think that generation infrastructure (nuclear, turbines, photovoltaic) and charging infrastructure are the limiters in 13 year's time. Cash is king and with enough money, we'll be done way before then.

We are just going to have to disagree here. I don't see how it can be done, if it is to be done, they need to start now at a much greater level or urgency than they are. We are talking about BANNING the sale of ICE's, conceptualise that for a second.

I don't see it and I guarantee they tweak the legislation to include plug in hybrids.