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09-22-2008, 09:59 PM | #67 | |
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That and the fact that quite frankly I would be worried about anything related to the Treasury right now. |
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09-23-2008, 12:14 PM | #68 | |
Galactic Emperor
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WTF !!???
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09-23-2008, 02:15 PM | #69 |
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This entire proposal is getting out of hand...it's like 90% being written by special interest groups.
Lol the implicit admission by the SEC that it's shorting rules were ridiculous shows how knee jerk reactions by regulators attempting to appease whiney CEOs/special interests does not play out well for an economy which thrives on free market principles. SEC now allows market makers & hedgers to short. |
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09-23-2008, 07:55 PM | #70 | |
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09-23-2008, 09:13 PM | #71 |
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The FBI is now investigating Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Lehman Brothers, and AIG. They are looking at possible fraud by those four institutions. The FBI will focus on the firms and their top management and executives who ran them.
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09-23-2008, 09:20 PM | #72 |
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Good! As far as I'm concerned they should all be charged with securities and exchange fraud. If I had my way.... well you can guess what that would be.
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09-25-2008, 02:07 AM | #73 |
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Hmm, very interesting why is the Fed pulling money out of the market?
As always take what you see with a grain of salt, but the table is correct. http://market-ticker.denninger.net/a...-Of-Mouth.html |
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09-25-2008, 10:07 AM | #74 |
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Home sales at 17 year low.
Durable goods down 4.5% Jobless rate highest as its been in 8 years Dollar falling like a gold painted terd in the Hudson Congress is getting ready to extend our national debt by nearly a trillion dollars and award it to the most unscrupulous lot in the world. Life is good... |
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09-25-2008, 12:51 PM | #75 | |
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Even more good news !
http://www.reuters.com/article/compa...16693720080925 Quote:
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09-25-2008, 09:44 PM | #76 | |
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Oh what the hell!
Wamu was siezed by the feds?? Ok this has got to stop. Quote:
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09-25-2008, 11:19 PM | #77 | |
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Some common sense from Ron Paul.
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09-25-2008, 11:39 PM | #78 |
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Ron Paul has a great deal of good common sense. It's too bad that the one big party doesn't have any others like it.
When I called my U.S. Senators and my U.S. Representative earlier today, I left them messages that do not mince words, something like: Vote no on anything that could be considered a bailout using taxpayer money... my money. Vote no on anything that resembles socialism. Listen to Ron Paul who has been warning all along about this financial disaster. I am livid at the attitude of all the Republicans and Democrats who claim to have known about these problems for a year, but did nothing to really deal with it, just acting like it is all OK. Now they suddenly say that there must be $700 billion more in bailouts and more socialism THIS WEEK! You aren't getting my money. VOTE NO!Call (202) 224-3121 for the U.S. capital switchboard operator. Ask for YOUR representative by name and state. Tell them what you think. http://www.house.gov/house/MemberWWW.shtml http://www.senate.gov/general/contac...nators_cfm.cfm |
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09-25-2008, 11:54 PM | #79 |
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I do believe that asking for the 700 billion dollar infusion was their checkmate move. Either way we hurt from it. If they had let the market correct itself it would come back fairly soon, but now there's no telling when it will come back.
If they say yes it will appear that all is well and the bubble will again inflate (temporarily). They will eventually run out of money again though. Incidently, interbank lending and credit will not be any better than it is today. The 700 billion dollars is to purchase bad securities at auction prices. The investment vehicles won't recoup their losses for a very long time once they go to auction. Their liquidity will remain the same and thus no money to lend. If they say no the markets will crash as people panic and run on their investment houses. Either way the average Joe is going to be hosed in the end. |
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09-26-2008, 12:34 AM | #80 |
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I'm not sure if this belongs here but one of my friends said that a 2nd great depression is a possibility. I didn't get to discuss the facts (besides the obvious financial crisis we are in) but is this really possible to happen soon?
kinda scary if true. |
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09-26-2008, 08:53 AM | #81 | |
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Not necessarily. The positions that Treasury will buy will be sold by reverse auction, that means the bank who sells will be the one who needs cash the most and will accept the lowest price. Treasury can hold these on the books with no MTM, and make no mistake its the MTM on these loans that is killing the banks. If held to maturity I'd expect a large majority of these loans to perform, but right now they are being held on the books of banks as if the vast majority will be nonperforming. The American tax payer could end up making a huge return on this trade.
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09-26-2008, 10:41 PM | #82 | ||
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So my beef with the above is that you're basing that on the fact that there has been some transparency in their financials and that they are really in not that bad of shape. In an ideal economic situation you would be right, but in the case of what's happened I doubt we are even close from an ideal situation. We've seen time after time banks and investment houses claim they are doing "ok" one week only to fail the next week. It's because of their accounting practices. There is definitely a reason why the FBI is investigating these institutions. Also, the Fed and other "large" banks ...cough...cough...J.P. Morgan have been dicking with the market since day 1. We really have had some dare I say nefarious decisions being made by the main Fed banks througought the entire ordeal. Just take a look at the slosh from the Fed for the past few weeks. Very interesting why they're taking liquidity out of the market when supposedly the entire problem is one of liquidity. In this type of environment the common man will absolutely NOT benefit and if we give them 700 billion more they'll just use it to finance their own takeovers and agendas. This is financial war plain and simple. Here is a good article on the whole subject: Quote:
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09-27-2008, 01:34 PM | #83 |
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Email to my U.S. Senator:
Vote NO on anything that resembles a bailout for financial institutions or other businesses. Also Vote NO on anything that bears resemblance to socialism or fascism. I have never voted for Rep. Ron Paul or given him any direct support, but I respect him and his message more now than ever. Ron Paul is one of the few people in Congress who has tried to do anything substantive to reform the financial system. Rather than committing taxpayer funds to provide hundred of billions of dollars to the Treasury Department and/or the Federal Reserve to manage the economic crisis, instead let failing businesses fail. The long-term effects of economic collapse is preferable to the long-term effects of more government, more agencies, and the tyranny of the powerful over the many. Let it crumble. From the ash heap, maybe we can eliminate the Federal Reserve. End the use of fiat money. Consider ending naked trading in derivatives. It is a tragedy that the government that is of, by, and for the people has made an environment for business to abuse the people. You further enrich the wealthy at the expense of all. This cycle must stop. Do not tax us more to try to fix it. You only make it worse. Government must decline, and freedom with liberty must increase. The founders of this nation warned about all that is happening today. That Congress and the Presidency have largely ignored the warnings, and appear to not have any idea of what this nation is supposed to be is troubling. We must stop it while we can. This monster is only getting bigger. There is no better opportunity to restore the Constitutional Republic and our freedom from tyranny than in a time of upheaval. Do not take us down the path that government advocates and gigantic businesses would have us go. |
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09-27-2008, 01:51 PM | #84 |
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You guys do know that if the bailout is not passed our country is basically "out of business" anyone that is opposed to it has no idea wtf is going on and the repercussions that it will cause.
You can write letters, strike, petition all you want, but in the end, the bailout is eminent. Both parties democratic/rep. knows this. But either wants to support it because 4-5 years from now, when the tax payers have to start paying, no one wants to be responsible for it, so what they are doing right now is pointing fingers even though they know it has to be done.
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09-27-2008, 06:02 PM | #85 | |
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09-27-2008, 07:36 PM | #86 |
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The depression of the 1930s brought us bigger government. Maybe the depression of 2009 will bring us less government. It appears that nothing else will stop government. If this bailout happens, it adds even more to bigger government than we already have. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac should have gone bust. Maybe AIG shouldn't have gotten the 85 billion dollars, but at least they are not off the hook. They have to pay it back.
The truth about the Republican establishment is becoming more obvious even to those who drink it in. They are not much different than the Democrat establishment. They have proven in their majority of 2003 to 2006 that they have little to no intention of fulfilling their promises of limited government. They only talk about that. They don't DO IT. Stop the cycle now. If the Federal Reserve System survives this, then we have not learned our lesson. They need to fall and not rise again. |
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09-27-2008, 10:11 PM | #87 |
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09-28-2008, 02:12 AM | #88 |
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If anyone had even the slightest doubt about who pulls the strings in this country, this whole debacle should tell you the answer. (Hint: its not the people)
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