Concerns about Apple’s T2 chip used in recent Macs and MacBooks

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by omasou

You can always come up with an edge case. Truth is WiFi is almost everywhere. The use case of poor or no connection is very rare. Even rarer is doing something so important while not connect that if lost would be tragic. If that tragic then get somewhere and backup!

In 1992, my manager asked if I could help him recover a PPT that he hadn't saved in the past 9 hours of work. Guess what the answer was. Also guess, what? He never forgot to save and back up his work again.

Again. FUD.

Spoken like someone that never ventures outside of a metropolitan area. Keep with your FUD. I guess wilderness areas where people want to go out to enjoy nature don't exist in your mind.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Spoken like someone that never ventures outside of a metropolitan area. Keep with your FUD. I guess wilderness areas where people want to go out to enjoy nature don't exist in your mind.

I fish in parks w/no cell connection all the time but one thing I never do is bring my computer and do work that I need to save and back up.

And do you honestly believe that say a photographer on safari in Africa is relying on WiFi or cell connections to back up data. NO. They bring a back up disk, in fact they probably bring multiple back up disks. The point is there are solutions for the not connected problem that have nothing to do w/security chips. Lastly, if you encrypt your hard drive and forget your password your in the same boat so has nothing to do w/Apple.

Again, your bring up edge cases to try and prove a point that doesn't exist in the real world.

[zx10guy]

No edge case. You're just being ridiculous. I can point to numerous locations I can drive out to from the DC Metro region where there is limited cell coverage and definitely no Wifi. You're bringing up ridiculous solutions for people that are just going on a hike or on vacation.

[detroitm2]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

No edge case. You're just being ridiculous. I can point to numerous locations I can drive out to from the DC Metro region where there is limited cell coverage and definitely no Wifi. You're bringing up ridiculous solutions for people that are just going on a hike or on vacation.

Eh. I don't think bringing an external backup device is ridiculous at all. If you are storing something important to you, why would you run the risk of losing it? Even if the data was not inhibited from being recovered by a 3rd party, why go through the trouble? What if the data was permanently damaged? (i.e. in a fire).

I take a TON of video and photos. Once they are downloaded off my camera(s), they are immediately loaded onto 2 separate storage devices. One I use for day-to-day editing (my laptop doesnt have enough space to handle some of the longer 4K content), and the other gets dropped into a cheap fireproof safe. It takes maybe 15-20 minutes depending on how much data I have to backup, but I know its always going to be there if something happens.

Now I'm not saying carry around a fireproof safe when you're on vacation, but its honestly not hard to get a cheap SSD/USB-C external drive for added insurance.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by detroitm2

Eh. I don't think bringing an external backup device is ridiculous at all. If you are storing something important to you, why would you run the risk of losing it? Even if the data was not inhibited from being recovered by a 3rd party, why go through the trouble? What if the data was permanently damaged? (i.e. in a fire).

I take a TON of video and photos. Once they are downloaded off my camera(s), they are immediately loaded onto 2 separate storage devices. One I use for day-to-day editing (my laptop doesnt have enough space to handle some of the longer 4K content), and the other gets dropped into a cheap fireproof safe. It takes maybe 15-20 minutes depending on how much data I have to backup, but I know its always going to be there if something happens.

Now I'm not saying carry around a fireproof safe when you're on vacation, but its honestly not hard to get a cheap SSD/USB-C external drive for added insurance.

It is ridiculous. Look around you when you travel and see if anyone is backing up their stuff while on their vacation. Ask any of your acquaintances if they travel with an external drive or some other means to proactively backup pictures they take. I would bet the percentage is pretty small. Not everyone is tech savvy or operate in a way that is best practices for those that are tech savvy.

[detroitm2]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

It is ridiculous. Look around you when you travel and see if anyone is backing up their stuff while on their vacation. Ask any of your acquaintances if they travel with an external drive or some other means to proactively backup pictures they take. I would bet the percentage is pretty small. Not everyone is tech savvy or operate in a way that is best practices for those that are tech savvy.

Eh. Agree to disagree on that one.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Maestro

I do not know who the guy is in the video or his background, but he obviously has ax to grind, maybe that ax is the fact he will not be able to repair Apple products in the future by doing chip swaps. Well at least not the T2 chip.

Not sure anyone notice, but he said someone attempted to solder on the board, therefore, someone messed with the board. He also claims it never seen water damage. Someone prior to him could have gotten their hands on the board could opened it up and dry it out before they took it to Apple. I personally gotten computer working again after someone dumped milk or coffee and I clean it up so well you could never tell it got wet. getting something wet does not always mean it going to die immediately.

Notice how he would not show the board on the camera too long, at one point he did stop long enough that I could see corrosion on some of the solder joints which leads me to believe there was some water damage or when the board was made it was not cleaned all that well. Most PCB's today go through and ultrasonic water/mild chemical cleaning process.

Now for his whole rant about the T2 chip, it is the encryption security chip and Apple is using a method of tying the chip to the specific board for the exact reason this guy is complaining about. It keeps people from doing what he wants to do put another chip on the board allow them to access your account information and information on your HDD if you turned on whole drive encryption. The chip is there to protect your information from people like this guy.

Also the fact he IR scan the chip and was complaining it was running at 35C is stupid. when the chips powers up they draw current and thus heat up and 35C is not out of the normal. I will guaranty there are chips hitting 40C to 50C in the computer.

I worked as Electrical Engineer for half my career and I spent a good number of those years in the computer industry and specifically mobile computing. I also work in networking and security hardware and what Apple is doing is not new, your Cable STB has been doing a similar thing for the last 15 yrs.

UPDATE: So I listen to this guy's rants about Apple's design mistake and loved his statement about how Apple keeps making the same mistakes over and over again but never show the same issue and even admitted some issues were caused by other companies who made the parts for Apple. He rant about how the 2008 unibody (notice the name unibody) mac was not machine out a single piece of AL then he went on to talk about the display and how it was two piece glue together. The guy miss the fact it was body of the MacBook which was one piece of AL not the display.

This guys view is simple, when a failure happens Apple or any company should fix it no questions asked even when Apple or another company may know the failure has nothing to do with the design or what Apple did but the user abused the product. Then goes on to talk about how it should have been done or handle differently. When I heard this from people I tell them since they know better than anyone else they are free to start their own company and do it better. As I said, I worked on new product design and there are design trade off being made everyday and at some point you have to ship a product otherwise your out of business. That also mean the product is not 100% perfect.

This guy rest his case on the fact we all hear about complains about Apple products, Apple user tend to voice their dissatisfaction more than other consumers since they spend more on the product, even a problem only a few are experiencing it seems like everyone is since they few issue are heard about by everyone. It like coming to the BMW forums, if you listen to all of us you think BMW were all falling about as we all drove down the road. This guy is claiming there are all kinds of problems with Apple since the few apple users are complaining the loudest.

After reading Maestro post and watching the video. It becomes very obvious this guy is a repair guy who was unable to charge his customer to recover his data.

Apple told the customer that there was water damage but the video conveniently doesn't show any of the LSIs.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/08...d_and_ram.html

[omasou]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

No edge case. You're just being ridiculous. I can point to numerous locations I can drive out to from the DC Metro region where there is limited cell coverage and definitely no Wifi. You're bringing up ridiculous solutions for people that are just going on a hike or on vacation.

My ridiculous edge case, the solution still applies. If you are working on important work that you cannot afford to lose then make sure you have a back up plan. If cellular and wifi are not options then use a portable external SSD, etc. I mean really, are you going to tell me that you are in the DC metro area with out coverage or a Starbucks. Really.

Originally Posted by zx10guy

Spoken like someone that never ventures outside of a metropolitan area. Keep with your FUD. I guess wilderness areas where people want to go out to enjoy nature don't exist in your mind.

You brought up the wilderness and now I'm being ridiculous.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by omasou

My ridiculous edge case, the solution still applies. If you are working on important work that you cannot afford to lose then make sure you have a back up plan. If cellular and wifi are not options then use a portable external SSD, etc. I mean really, are you going to tell me that you are in the DC metro area with out coverage or a Starbucks. Really.

Yes. You're being ridiculous again. People go on quick excursions out to areas where there is limited to no coverage whether it be wireless or cellular. You're applying a your idiotic situation to someone who is just going out on a recreational excursion. I challenge you to find anyone going out on a hike to have all that crap you're bringing up. Let alone anyone going on a vacation.

You brought up the wilderness and now I'm being ridiculous.

Yes. You're still being ridiculous. My point is I'm in a densely populated metro area and it doesn't take much effort to drive out to a location where there is limited wireless coverage. Put that point seems to be lost to your narrow point of view.

[vreihen16]

I accidentally dropped my Brownie Hawkeye 620 camera over Niagara Falls as a kid. If only I had backed it up to icloud.....


.

[zx10guy]

https://www.ifixit.com/News/apple-is...to-iphones-now

[omasou]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

https://www.ifixit.com/News/apple-is...to-iphones-now

Read that the other day. That's fantastic now people don't have to worry about buying a used phone with an incorrect or improperly installed battery.

Face it private repair shops will need to focus on PCs and Chromebooks. Apple and Apple customer don't need or want them. Only those that don't care or that are trying to save buck care about this stuff.

Also as much as you hate to admit it computers and phones are disposable items and a good portion of people upgrade vs. trying to keep older hardware working.

Instead of pounding your head against the wall trying to convince people that Apple is evil or a monopoly; instead vote w/your wallet. Buy everything non-Apple.

[Obioban]

I'm holding off on upgrading to a new iMac until it has the T2

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by omasou

Read that the other day. That's fantastic now people don't have to worry about buying a used phone with an incorrect or improperly installed battery.

Face it private repair shops will need to focus on PCs and Chromebooks. Apple and Apple customer don't need or want them. Only those that don't care or that are trying to save buck care about this stuff.

Also as much as you hate to admit it computers and phones are disposable items and a good portion of people upgrade vs. trying to keep older hardware working.

Instead of wasting your time trying to convince people that Apple is evil or a monopoly; instead vote w/your wallet. Buy everything non-Apple.

I'm putting information out there for people to make a wide open decision on whether they want to keep supporting companies that practice the tactics being presented here. You've already made clear your bias and as such I really don't care what you do. If you want to continue to support a company which controls every aspect of how you use your product to include the ability to have choice on where to repair it. By all means knock yourself out.

Quality repairs at an Apple store? Don't make me laugh. Post #34 from a Youtuber who doesn't hate Apple got a real nice quality repair there. And even though he eventually was taken care of, he even brings up whether the final outcome would have been the same had people at Apple didn't see the video he put out there. As much as you hate Louis, he's put out quite a few videos which show the quality repairs of the Genius bar....that's if they can even repair the item in store without needing to ship it off. That's also if they charge you so much for the repair that they're pushing you to buy new product when the actual repair could be done for only a fraction of the cost. Keep drinking the Kool Aid.

All my posts have been worth it as there has been on respondent on this thread that was enlightened by what it means to be part of the cult of "Think Different."

[omasou]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

I'm putting information out there for people to make a wide open decision on whether they want to keep supporting companies that practice the tactics being presented here. You've already made clear your bias and as such I really don't care what you do. If you want to continue to support a company which controls every aspect of how you use your product to include the ability to have choice on where to repair it. By all means knock yourself out.

Quality repairs at an Apple store? Don't make me laugh. Post #34 from a Youtuber who doesn't hate Apple got a real nice quality repair there. And even though he eventually was taken care of, he even brings up whether the final outcome would have been the same had people at Apple didn't see the video he put out there. As much as you hate Louis, he's put out quite a few videos which show the quality repairs of the Genius bar....that's if they can even repair the item in store without needing to ship it off. That's also if they charge you so much for the repair that they're pushing you to buy new product when the actual repair could be done for only a fraction of the cost. Keep drinking the Kool Aid.

All my posts have been worth it as there has been on respondent on this thread that was enlightened by what it means to be part of the cult of "Think Different."

No, you are reposting youtube videos of one sided opinions. Youtube != News.

This is article is an example of "informing" and even links to the video of the guy buying a "an official Apple battery" OK....
https://appleinsider.com/articles/19...al-replacement. Love the video...Apple is being sneaky...well Ti invented the lock but Apple sucks b/c they're using it. LOL.

Instead why don't you take the time to write your own well thought out editorial explaining both sides and why you agree or disagree w/one side or the other.

Sans battery replacement. Facts are electronics are not really designed to be repaired. It's equivalent to you being out of warranty, having your radio die and complaining BMW charged you for a new radio instead of taking it apart and replacing a $5 chip or resistor. That ship has long sailed.

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by omasou

No, you are reposting youtube videos of one sided opinions. Youtube != News.

This is article is an example of "informing" and even links to the video of the guy buying a "an official Apple battery" OK....
https://appleinsider.com/articles/19...al-replacement. Love the video...Apple is being sneaky...well Ti invented the lock but Apple sucks b/c they're using it. LOL.

Instead why don't you take the time to write your own well thought out editorial explaining both sides and why you agree or disagree w/one side or the other.

Sans battery replacement. Facts are electronics are not really designed to be repaired. It's equivalent to you being out of warranty, having your radio die and complaining BMW charged you for a new radio instead of taking it apart and replacing a $5 chip or resistor. That ship has long sailed.

Yawn.