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10-18-2024, 07:06 AM | #45 | |
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The problem is thinking like a Politician and not like an engineer, physicist, chemist, and businessman. Writing words on a piece of paper just doesn't make it so. A global shift to EV is just not realistic. The vision is flawed because no human activity is done for the benefit of the planet's climate; it's a flawed concept. Industrialists who actually create products rather than legislation have a realistic view of the world. When Government drives the development of the automobile the result is the Yogo and Trabant, not BMWs. Politicians don't understand the concept of "profit motive". The i3 was not a sales success and did not generate profit, which is why it was dropped. Last edited by Efthreeoh; 10-18-2024 at 09:09 AM.. |
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10-18-2024, 09:14 AM | #46 |
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It's best for BMW to say what he's saying so anything he says I consider where and why he is saying it. If I tell my boss some giant project I am given isn't doable, he would also consider the possibility I am saying what is best for me.
On the other hand, I agree 2035 isn't realistic, also understand any major market change will come with a lot of negatives for some. Just resisting it won't change the final outcome. China seeming to be far ahead of the rest in this market I'm sure scares the established ICE manufacturers. From a selfish, doing what is best for the manufacturers in our country it's a mistake to decide now that EV's won't work long term, go all in on what we are doing now. If we are wrong we will be out of the market. In the 70's U.S. manufacturers were slow to adapt to small, fuel effiicient cars, Japanese were far ahead, we let the Japanese take a huge part of the market.
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10-18-2024, 12:43 PM | #47 | |
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China (correctly) assumes that if they sell EVs significantly cheaper than everyone else, it won't matter that they're crappy and poor quality, nobody will look into the dirty secrets of their supply chain and western consumers will buy them and treat them as disposable. |
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10-18-2024, 03:38 PM | #48 |
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Totally agree about Chinese carmakers' unfair systemic advantages from their government... but disagree about quality. Have you actually seen one of BYD's recent EVs? I have, and I was frankly shocked at how good their fit and finish & material quality was. They're far from perfect, but they're also far from crappy.
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10-18-2024, 03:55 PM | #49 | ||
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Last edited by David70; 10-18-2024 at 04:26 PM.. |
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10-18-2024, 06:14 PM | #50 | |
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10-18-2024, 06:20 PM | #51 | |
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Thats not even talking about your Foxconns of the world. I worked with a plant in Chengdu, we had some former foxconn employees there. They told me stories of some.lf.their friends who were laborers were forced to pay more for boarding and food than they would make for the first 2 years..they were literally losing money the first year or two, paying their debt to the company off, and only after a few years swere they actually earning any money. This was somehow better than their economic prospects in small rural villages. Most of them would work there for a few years while sending money back to their homes, then eventually just not show back up after new year. Also, you can't take anything Farley says seriously. He's both running Ford into the ground, and a total talking head, who will tell you they're all in on gas V8s one day, then turn around and tell another group of people about how great EVs are the next, then tell a 3rd group that's EVs and V8s are dumb and turbo hybrids are the future. He says whatever the group he's speaking to wants to hear. |
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10-18-2024, 06:47 PM | #52 | |
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10-18-2024, 09:38 PM | #53 | |
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At this point, lifting the ban wouldn't really help them much, if any, in the long term... Chinese EV makers won't slow down or stop... China was smart about it. They forced automakers to form joint ventures with Chinese manufacturers to build cars in China and they all rushed over there letting greed drive them. China has now taken that expertise and starting building the future of the automotive market... Lifting the bans and slowing down will turn over their automotive industry to China... EVs are the future no matter how you slice it. It is suicide to fall behind. |
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10-19-2024, 08:53 AM | #54 | |
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A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission. "Yeah, but NO ONE puts an automatic trans shift knob on a manual transmission."
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10-19-2024, 08:58 AM | #55 | |
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An outright ban of all Chinese imports phased in over a few years is the correct course of action. |
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10-19-2024, 08:59 AM | #56 | |
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A manual transmission can be set to "comfort", "sport", and "track" modes simply by the technique and speed at which you shift it; it doesn't need "modes", modes are for manumatics that try to behave like a real 3-pedal manual transmission. If you can money-shift it, it's a manual transmission. "Yeah, but NO ONE puts an automatic trans shift knob on a manual transmission."
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10-19-2024, 09:44 AM | #57 | |
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10-20-2024, 03:59 AM | #58 | |
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Last edited by Efthreeoh; 10-20-2024 at 08:25 AM.. |
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10-20-2024, 09:22 PM | #59 | |
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China never made inroads with ICEVs because they're a lot harder to engineer quality into. An EV is basically a.aet.of commoditized products, electric motors, batteries, etc are all just stuff you buy from whoever. The only way that China would have really broke into the ICE market would have been via buying stuff from other companies, they likely could have sourced transmissions from ZF or Aisin, engines, well what automaker would have been dumb enough to do that? They could have maybeb contracted Yamaha or someone to develop and build one for them, but that'd be expensive. |
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10-20-2024, 09:43 PM | #60 | |
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Last edited by Efthreeoh; 10-21-2024 at 05:27 AM.. |
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10-22-2024, 09:03 AM | #61 |
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They are all starting to flap inc VW but it seems strange that they have publicly embraced the move right up until the point they realised that they won't win, but that must have been clear right from the start China hasn't just blown in, they knew before there was this risk.
They got greedy as hell during and after the late unpleasantness and have pushed pricing to the moon and lowered quality, their EV sales are taxpayer subsidised so they just pushed the margins up which has led to the residuals falling off a cliff after the first lease which their finance arms now have to swallow. Although the EU and other governments in the West are also to blame, with their unachievable targets and fine programs it was all bound to end in tears. Someone should buy the CEO a book on the demise of Kodak.
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10-22-2024, 12:49 PM | #62 |
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