How long to wait before asking for a raise at work?

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

This has been very informative and one of the more productive threads I have seen here.

That's only because you weren't around for the "Ask a girl anything" threads, either version 1 or version 2.

Version 3 sucked, because I started it, with an effort at telling a joke, but I withheld the punch line hoping to use it later, and so it didn't look like a joke. And it just never really took off.

[King Rudi]

I'll begin searching for said threads.

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by atmosphericM

First of all, thanks again to you as well as the others here that took their time to lend me advice. I respect your views even if I don't agree with all of them. I definitely respect that I'm still relatively young, and that to an extent, wisdom comes with age. There is a lot I don't know or understand. But, I'm doing my best.

I absolutely agree that the company isn't a good fit for me. If that didn't seem apparent, I apologize. That said, I believe I have the mental "toughness," if you will, to stay here for some time longer, if I deem that to be my best option for the future. It's also certainly possible that leaving for a "fresh start" is my best option. It's one I will certainly consider, even more now. That said, for aforementioned reasons, I obviously feel, at least for now, that staying put is best for me despite the culture issues, etc. Plus, even if it isn't great here, there are some things that appeal to my needs such as self-managing, freedom in decision making (trust), and for at least a little while.. the most important of all.. a challenge. I've had a few different roles, most of them were pretty awful. Perhaps I'm just not patient enough. It's weird, I'm a very patient person overall. But I don't seem to want to do mind-numbing work for years before someone trusts me to actually use my mind and make real decisions. Go figure. I know, I know.. "the game," right?



This stood out to me of course so I wanted to touch on it. I'm not sure what you mean, exactly, by "beneath me," but I want to be clear that I do not feel that I am "better than" the company, or the position. I do feel, though, that the companies culture isn't a good fit for me personally, and that I am capable of handling far more than this position requires.

And hey, I never said they'd outright fold, lol. They'd be struggling and very annoyed for a while, and would definitely regret it over a few thousand dollars a year, though.



That's exactly what I am doing here. I can loathe the politics, but of course I still have to play the game. That's why I started this thread.

But you are right, and it sounds like you get me, more or less (about as much as possible via forum communications ). But I'll be a martyr, anyway, within reason. It's who I am. I'll take some hits to make the world a little better. I give a shit about people, and about doing what is right. For me, that isn't just a slogan I put on my corporate website so that I can attract customers and talent. And I am a bit cynical, but that doesn't mean I don't wake up each day looking for the good in life. I still hold out hope that there are others, mentors, places with views more closely aligned with mine. After all, there are plenty of cultures in the world that vary greatly. One thing about me is that I never give up.

I may have read too much into your post in coming to the collusion that you felt the role was beneath you. That being said, you clearly are disillusioned with the company and the leadership. That alone is reason to leave. Why be a martyr and suffer away for no purpose. You're a self-proclaimed idealist in a company that does not give a F. Some people can shrug that off by not caring, but it clearly eats at you. Best to pull the plug and go someplace where you will get the mentoring and development you deserve. Go someplace where your ideas and contributions are valued so you can be proud of what you do and who you do it for. I guarantee you it's 100% more enjoyable than suffering as a martyr that no one notices or cares about.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

I'll begin searching for said threads.

Search made easy:

https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...+girl+anything
(The bad one)

https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...+girl+anything
(The original)

And there was one in between I think, but most posts are deleted I think.

[King Rudi]

Appreciated. Apparently I really suck at trying to find things on here.

[atmosphericM]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

This 100%... but people have trouble with remaining happy with their pay when they make less than anyone they work with, regardless of work product, work ethic, etc. For some reason people seem to feel entitled to the same pay no matter what they do in my experience. Being unhappy leads to even worse work product... personally I think knowing other people's salary is not a great thing. At my last company I fought tooth and nail for a large increase for a job I was taking (had to be approved by the CEO). Then talking to a coworker (same title, group, work, etc) I find out they are making 50% more than me because they were working in consulting previously and came in from a higher salary instead of being internal at a lower one. I became very unhappy and ended up leaving that job shortly thereafter because of this. IMO, ignorance is bliss sometimes.

Ignorance can certainly be bliss, but didn't you use that information to then move and earn more? I'm assuming (hoping) that you transitioned to a different company and ended up earning more than at the first place, and rightfully so. IMO this exact story is part of what's effed up about the process. I absolutely agree that people should be compensated by merit, and that not all employees on a given team, doing the same work, deserve the same pay. But if they are all doing the same job, complete the same amount of work and deliver the same quality, don't they all deserve roughly the same compensation? I think it's ridiculous that employee A is paid X, and had to FIGHT for it, simply because the company was aware of his previous salary, while employee B is paid 50% just because he knew how to negotiate or something (probably just lied about his previous salary).

I mean I get it, this is how the world works. I'm all for a free market and negotiations, and I'm just fine with your situation there as it began. But I feel that you should have been able to IMMEDIATELY go to your manager, point out the pay discrepancy, and be bumped up to the higher level.. assuming your quality of work was the same as the other guy. At that point, the company should simply be happy that they got such a good deal on you for a little while, and have no hard feelings about paying you more going forward. They've surely already done the math and have determined that your work is worth X+50% or employee B wouldn't be getting it! If they say no, walk away and go get that higher salary elsewhere. If you're a good employee, it shouldn't be too hard. The system can work. Thing is, not enough people walk, and not enough people talk, so we essentially are allowing the employers to practice this way. I don't blame them for trying, it's natural, but I do blame them for acting like us sharing our salary info is taboo, and sometimes it's even literally against "handbook rules."

There is nothing wrong with starting an employee at whatever salary you feel they deserve. When they aren't working for you yet, it's probably pretty damn hard to determine what they're worth. But after a year, or even six months, if their quality of work matches other employees that are paid much more, it is IMO appropriate, THEN, for the manager to pro-actively reach out to that employee and offer them more money in order to retain that good talent and to stop disenfranchising the work-force in general.

[stbm5]

Originally Posted by 2000cs

In all my decades of managing people I have never taken this bait. Why? Because if you go so far to get a viable, competing offer, you have made the mental break and I have lost your engagement already. Plus, now I don’t really trust you to be fully on board with our team. Don’t need lone wolves.

simply not true. many employers will take advantage until you present them with the fact that someone will value you more.

[atmosphericM]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

I may have read too much into your post in coming to the collusion that you felt the role was beneath you. That being said, you clearly are disillusioned with the company and the leadership. That alone is reason to leave. Why be a martyr and suffer away for no purpose. You're a self-proclaimed idealist in a company that does not give a F. Some people can shrug that off by not caring, but it clearly eats at you. Best to pull the plug and go someplace where you will get the mentoring and development you deserve. Go someplace where your ideas and contributions are valued so you can be proud of what you do and who you do it for. I guarantee you it's 100% more enjoyable than suffering as a martyr that no one notices or cares about.

Absolutely, sir. And thanks again for the good advice. To be clear - I wasn't really saying that I'm a martyr here in this role. I was just saying that in life, in general, I do "hurt myself" in some ways because sometimes doing the right thing warrants it. Like if I worked for a company that paid me tons but I learned they were earning their revenue off the backs of slaves, I would quit in a heartbeat. Many people, dare I say most, aren't like that.

[atmosphericM]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

Some of the happiest people I know are the least self aware. Once a person becomes more aware of their environment and status, it then becomes a balancing act of choosing what you allow to upset you or prioritizing what gets your appreciation and what gets your motivation to change things.

I couldn't agree more, but our level of awareness isn't really up to us, IMO. My brain is always on rapid-fire. If I'm not actively engaged and challenged by something, it's running all over the place and wants to understand and scrutinize every detail of life. I don't feel that this is something I can 'turn off.' In many ways I am jealous of the 'simpler individual' that is clearly different. But we are who we are, and gotta make due with it. We all have strengths and weaknesses, and have to learn how to apply them to life in order to live it to it's fullest. (Or whatever you personally believe in, spiritually. )

[King Rudi]

Originally Posted by atmosphericM

I couldn't agree more, but our level of awareness isn't really up to us, IMO. My brain is always on rapid-fire. If I'm not actively engaged and challenged by something, it's running all over the place and wants to understand and scrutinize every detail of life. I don't feel that this is something I can 'turn off.' In many ways I am jealous of the 'simpler individual' that is clearly different. But we are who we are, and gotta make due with it. We all have strengths and weaknesses, and have to learn how to apply them to life in order to live it to it's fullest. (Or whatever you personally believe in, spiritually. )

You remind me so much of myself 10 years ago. I was a go-getter and a demon when it came to work. I wanted to know everything little detail and why. I am typically still this way, but I have also learned to gauge my environment and act accordingly. Take my current employer as an example. I was hired to relieve my supervisor from some of his responsibilities as his plate was overflowing. Said supervisor (this is his first management position) feels threatened by me and doesn't like to divulge information as he wants to be "The Man." Rather than accept me and my position, he continues to not utilize me at all, unless it's simply something he doesn't want to deal with. Meanwhile, the plant manager has resigned and corporate has done some realigning of funds which lead to a cut in my budget for this fiscal year. I went from $16m to $110k thus resulting in many of the projects I had scoped for this year being axed. At this time, they pay me to sit in an office and find things to do to keep myself busy. They have also asked me to help fill in for positions when employees are on vacation.

Now, no one here knows what my responsibilities are, including myself. Do I allow this to bother me and drive me insane? It used to. Now I have come to realize that this job isn't so much an open door to advance myself in the company as it is only a stepping stone for me to better myself with another company in the future. This job will allow me to gain experience and polish up my resume a little. This job also serves the purpose of allowing me to work on myself in the meantime.

Rather than allowing things to get to you, recognize the situation and environment for what they are and adapt. You'll find peace this way. Finances, making money and more importantly managing money are all key, but peace of mind is so much more valuable. My advice is learn how to balance both. Don't get me wrong, I applaud your understanding of your current situation and the recognition that a change is needed; but take solace in the fact that you have this mindset and know that this will bring the change you need.

[King Rudi]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Search made easy:

https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...+girl+anything
(The bad one)

https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...+girl+anything
(The original)

And there was one in between I think, but most posts are deleted I think.

I'm on page 5 of the original......I will not be productive in any manner today. Thank you for this.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

I'm on page 5 of the original......I will not be productive in any manner today. Thank you for this.

Happy to help!

[Yapakanichi]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

I'm on page 5 of the original......I will not be productive in any manner today. Thank you for this.

PAGE 5 OF THE BAD OR GOOD LOL

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

I'm on page 5 of the original......I will not be productive in any manner today. Thank you for this.

This is why the older members are good to have around - we know where all the good stuff is buried.

[King Rudi]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

This is why the older members are good to have around - we know where all the good stuff is buried.

Same can be said of men our age in real life.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

Same can be said of men our age in real life.

True that, but being only 36, I don't like to give myself the "old" label just yet.

Just....wiser than I was in my 20's....

[King Rudi]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

True that, but being only 36, I don't like to give myself the "old" label just yet.

Just....wiser than I was in my 20's....

You still know where the good stuff is though, don't you?

[CTinline-six]

Thread officially de-railed.

[Uber Commuter]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

Im all for this on one condition.

Just to confirm, you know that was posted in jest, right?

[King Rudi]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

Thread officially de-railed.

It was only a matter of time. We managed to do this without Lups somehow.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by CTinline-six

Thread officially de-railed.

What - we all chimed in with our advice and provided the OP with a good amount of information for the first 2 and a half pages. We're all done with the original topic, there is simply no more to say that hasn't already been said. It was time to divert to a new topic. As I usually do without bothering to create a separate thread.

Originally Posted by Not_Judy

It was only a matter of time. We managed to do this without Lups somehow.

That's true. I think she's splitting her time between redoing a house from foundation up and the politics subforum. So I stepped in to pinch hit for her.

Thread diversion has long been a specialty of mine.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by knowthebattle

wait....so you left the job. You are unemployed? Or making less than you were at the company that paid you as little as they could?

I started looking for another job and got one that paid more (still less than my coworker was making but more than I was) within a short time, after which I put in my 2 weeks. This was a little over 2 years ago.