Still want an EV? (NO POLITICS)

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by gblansten

My understanding is that only EVs are flammable. We should all take five right now and think of the children.

You mean these children mining Cobalt for EV batteries?


Teed that right up for me.

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

You mean these children mining Cobalt for EV batteries?


Teed that right up for me.

Or the children who have died in the last hundred years of war over oil. Either way.

[gonzo]

^
I've got a handful of filled speech balloons for the young one looking at the camera...

Bet he'd like to come to our horribly racist and unjust country.
We are overrun with oblivious ninnies.

[eugenebmw]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

You mean these children mining Cobalt for EV batteries?


Teed that right up for me.

Forget about this picture. All the EVs ppl have tunnel vision and blind All they see is this

[eugenebmw]

I don't have a chemistry degree. Point me out if I am wrong.

EV battery raw materials

The primary materials that make up an EV battery are lithium, manganese, and cobalt. A report by Nature estimates that a typical EV battery uses about 8 kilograms of lithium, 14 kilograms of cobalt, and 20 kilograms of manganese.

Let’s explore below each material’s mining process and its environmental impact.

Lithium-ion

Lithium is mainly produced from salt flats or underground brine reservoirs, with most of the production concentrated in South America (namely Bolivia, Argentina, and Chile) and China.

Extracting lithium from the brine is fairly straightforward and is done by evaporating the water to leave behind a lithium-rich solution.

Lithium mining’s environmental impact
Because of this evaporation process, lithium mining uses a large amount of groundwater that gets lost in the process. This can deprive local communities of drinking water and harms farming by reducing the water available for irrigation – especially given that most of the world’s lithium is extracted in arid regions with scarce water supplies in the first place.

On top of that, the remaining liquid left after lithium is extracted can contain toxic or radioactive elements and needs to be cleaned and stored before it can be released.

Cobalt

Besides lithium, cobalt is an often-cited culprit in EV batteries’ environmental and social impact. Cobalt is currently one of the main components of an EV battery’s cells.

Cobalt mining
Cobalt is produced as a byproduct of copper and nickel mining but can also be mined directly, with Australia and the Democratic Republic of the Congo (DRC) being the main producers.

Cobalt is perhaps one of the most problematic materials used in electric vehicles, both environmentally and socially. Cobalt mines produce toxic residues that can leach into the environment, poisoning groundwater and harming nearby communities. Additionally, smelting cobalt ore produces fumes with a high concentration of sulfur oxide and other air pollutants.

On top of their environmental impact, cobalt mines also raise labor concerns. With little formal regulation and oversight, workers in cobalt mines are often underpaid and lack adequate protective equipment, tools, and training. These dangerous conditions create problematic labor practices, which can lead to injury or even death.

Question: Is it ok to kill or injury people to save the world? Is it ok to kill or injury people to make other people lives better?

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by gblansten

Or the children who have died in the last hundred years of war over oil. Either way.

If we were really interested in the lives of children maybe the 73 million induced abortions or 200,000 abortions per day world wide (WHO) would matter but it doesn't, does it. As long as people can hum along in their EV's or worry about who Taylor Swift is dating we will all be fine.

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by eugenebmw

I don't have a chemistry degree. Point me out if I am wrong.
EV battery raw materials

You left out
Copper (deep pit mining)
Aluminum (bauxite surface mining). major transportation cost. massive energy required to Smelt.
And we can't even get off our collective lazy ass's to recycle.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by RM7

https://www.yahoo.com/news/watch-pip...142035973.html

S'MORES anyone?

[Car-Addicted]

100 Firefighters Battled Massive Battery Fire At GM’s Flagship EV Plant In Detroit
2/01/2024
It has been revealed that $1 million worth of damage was done to GM’s Factory Zero electric vehicle factory in Detroit, Michigan, when a fire broke out on December 19 last year.

The automaker says the fire was likely triggered by a forklift puncturing a battery materials container. The blaze prompted a massive response from local authorities with almost 100 firefighters and two dozen fire trucks responding to the scene.

An incident report obtained through a Freedom of Information Act request reveals that one firefighter was injured after slipping outside the plant and notes that all responders were exposed to lithium-ion off-gas.

https://www.carscoops.com/2024/02/10...t-in-december/

Nothing to see here move along

[Car-Addicted]

Suburban Chicago man says dashboard of his Tesla caught fire out of the blue
02/01/2024
Ali Amjad of Oak Brook said his Tesla was not even at the charging station – or even connected to power – yet somehow, an electrical fire or explosion happened. He has been left wondering how Tesla will compensate him, and exactly how big of a safety problem this may be.
"I think we're also very scared," said Amjad.
he car sat in the same spot where the family's other Tesla was sitting days later.
"What if our car was sitting in the garage at that moment?" said Amjad. "Like, our house could have lit on fire."
"And not only that, then it's 10 days later – and you guys are just saying, 'Hey, get your insurance company – let them investigate it,'" said Amjad.

So Amjad called CBS 2 - and CBS 2 emailed Tesla to ask why the company would not honor his warranty. CBS 2 also wanted an understanding into what led to his dashboard catching fire.

For 10 days, Amjad got nothing – but three hours after CBS 2's email, he got a call, and Tesla made an offer.

"They tell me that they'll work with me to buy back the vehicle of some sort," Amjad said.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/othe...ue/ar-BB1hwzbB

[infinitekidM2C]

on the plus side, ev's can help keep you warm and it is winter...

[gblansten]

https://hgi-fire.com/welding-sparks-...injures-three/



Approximately 200 employees were evacuated from Sodecia Stamping Company, an automotive stamping plant and parts supply company, in Roseville, MI on March 5th when a two-alarm fire ignited. The fire resulted in three injuries and $500,000 in damages. Fire officials believe the fire broke out while workers were welding items on a conveyor belt in a 30-foot deep pit that contained oil, compressed air lines, gasoline, and other hazardous materials.

One worker was trapped in the pit, but was able to escape before firefighters arrived. The man was taken to the hospital and was treated for smoke inhalation. Two other workers were also treated for smoke inhalation.

Roseville Interim Fire Chief, Michael Holland, stated, “This was truly one of the worst kind of fires you can have. You have a fire in an industrial factory, a man in a confined space, and a building filled with hazardous materials.” Holland went on to say, “It was a serious situation. We didn’t want the fire to spread. It could have been much worse.”

Firefighters were able to extinguish the fire in 35 minutes, using water and foam. Hazmat teams also dumped dirt into the storm drain grates to prevent chemicals and oil from getting mixed in with the city’s water system.

Sodecia is headquartered in Portugal and is a supplier of metal-formed components and mechanical assemblies to the automotive industry.

[gblansten]

https://www.reuters.com/business/aut...ji-2023-10-16/

TOKYO, Oct 17 (Reuters) - Toyota Motor (7203.T)
, opens new tab, the world's biggest automaker by sales, will extend until Wednesday a partial production halt at two domestic assembly plants due to an accident at a supplier's facility, a company spokesperson said.
The incident at supplier Chuo Spring (5992.T)
, opens new tab, which makes engine and valve springs used in vehicles, also halted some production at group companies Toyota Auto Body and Toyota Industries (6201.T)
, opens new tab.
The impacted lines would remain halted due to the incident, while a line at a plant of another group company, Gifu Auto Body, used for manufacturing of the Toyota Coaster minibus would also be stopped, the spokesperson said.
A spokesperson for Chuo Spring said an accident involving an explosion in a building at its Fujioka plant around 12:15 p.m. (0315 GMT) on Monday resulted in damage to the facility, adding that the police and the fire department were investigating.
Production in five lines at three Toyota Auto Body plants - all of the unit's lines - was stopped due to the accident, affecting production of minivans such as the Alphard as well as some Land Cruiser models, including for overseas markets.
The halted Toyota lines are at the automaker's Takaoka and Tsutsumi plants, both in Toyota City in central Japan which is also home to its headquarters.
Operations at all 14 of Toyota's domestic assembly plants ground to a halt in August due to a system malfunction.
Shares of Toyota on Tuesday closed up 0.8% at 2,681 yen, in line with broader market gains.

[gblansten]

https://www.waff.com/2023/10/24/abso...-catches-fire/

CADES COVE, Tenn. (WVLT/Gray News) – What started off as a spontaneous day in the Great Smoky Mountains turned into a nightmare when a car burst into flames in Tennessee, WVLT reports.

Jessica Ariks and her three daughters were riding with the windows down, singing, talking and laughing Sunday afternoon, but as they were at the entrance of Cades Cove, they heard a weird, loud popping noise, and all the dashboard lights turned on.

Ariks said she looked up and saw white smoke over the hood of her car. Within a couple of seconds, she heard a stranger telling her and her daughters to get out of the car because it was on fire.

There were flames underneath the van that Ariks could not see.

“No idea at all. For the van, I just recently had the oil changed, two new tires, tires were rotated. My dad is a stickler for car maintenance. He kept up with it for me. There were no warning lights, no sound. It was driving perfectly fine. I mean there was absolutely no warning at all,” she said.

Ariks said a lot of her valuables were lost to the fire, but the things she cherished the most that she will not be able to get back are mementos of lost family members.

“The most heartbreaking thing as far as what we lost was in my center console, I kept a necklace that belonged to my mother, and on my key ring, I had a ring that she had given me. Just a little metal ring. She passed away 18 months ago, and I didn’t grab those, and they are gone. Most of the things can be replaced. I am just thankful that we are OK,” Ariks said.

Ariks is currently driving a rental car. They said they are thankful for the stranger who was yelling at them to get out of their car.

[Car-Addicted]

Fire broke out at Tesla factory in Fremont, California
A fire broke out at the Tesla factory in Fremont, California late Thursday afternoon, but was contained within a few hours.
The plant has a history of fires, and is under an investigation for possible Clean Air Act violations by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.

Fire at PG&E's California Tesla battery facility fully under control
The incident, which caused a part of the Highway 1 in California to shut down, came about a year after another fire broke out in a Tesla's "Megapack" battery unit in Australia during testing of one of the world's biggest energy storage projects. read more

Fire at Tesla's Fremont factory under control, no injuries reported
The fire was caused by hydraulic fluid coming in contact with molten aluminum, the spokeswoman said.

All quickly put out. On hand water and foam. I can do this all day.

[gblansten]

Originally Posted by Car-Addicted

Fire broke out at Tesla factory in Fremont, California
A fire broke out at the Tesla factory in Fremont, California late Thursday afternoon, but was contained within a few hours.
The plant has a history of fires, and is under an investigation for possible Clean Air Act violations by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.

Fire at PG&E's California Tesla battery facility fully under control
The incident, which caused a part of the Highway 1 in California to shut down, came about a year after another fire broke out in a Tesla's "Megapack" battery unit in Australia during testing of one of the world's biggest energy storage projects. read more

Fire at Tesla's Fremont factory under control, no injuries reported
The fire was caused by hydraulic fluid coming in contact with molten aluminum, the spokeswoman said.

All quickly put out. On hand water and foam. I can do this all day.

Automotive materials and processes lend to flammability. I suspect we both can multi-post until we leave this mortal coil.

[Efthreeoh]

Gasoline is flammable.

[gblansten]

I have to say: I continue to enjoy this thread and I would have a beer with any of you. No hard feelings on the varying takes on EVs.

[M5Rick]

Taught a lesson by a normal Joe.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/re...st-56-bln.html

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Taught a lesson by a normal Joe.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/re...st-56-bln.html

He should have sued Musk to have Tesla hire some real automotive designers and redesign its ugly-ass line up.

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by gblansten

Automotive materials and processes lend to flammability. I suspect we both can multi-post until we leave this mortal coil.

I figured you were going to have to break out the Pinto flaming gas tanks soon.

[Car-Addicted]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Taught a lesson by a normal Joe.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/re...st-56-bln.html

No we are taught a lesson on socialism. There is a contract with performance goals and compensation based on those goals that was met and surpassed. Musk funded this company in 2008 and was to be compensated on market cap. In the real world that is referred to as ROI. Is there a Musk in Russia, North Korea, China? Will there ever be another Musk in America with socialist judges making the rules? Is any one dumb enough to think this is not because Musk bought Twitter/X and doesn't toe the party line?

Q. Thank you. You’ve been the CEO of Tesla for how long, sir?
A. Well, officially, I suppose, since mid-2008. Effectively, I’ve been in charge of the company from the Series A round of April 2004.
Q. Prior to 2009, were you compensated for being the CEO of the company?
A. No. I don’t think so, no.
Q. Okay. Do you recall that in 2009, an option plan was put in place for your compensation?
A. Yes.
Q. And just in general terms, do you recall on what basis you would be awarded options under the 2009 plan?
A. That was, I think, half time-based vesting and half of milestone-based vesting, contingent on the Model S success.

Q. Was there any litigation over that plan, do you recall? Were you or the board sued over granting you that option plan?
A. No.
Q. Do you recall if there was any litigation, anybody sue you or the board, over granting you those ten increments of a half point each for $40 billion in market appreciation?
A. No.
https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/22/...ull-transcript

This should tell you all you need to know:
Elizabeth Warren
@SenWarren
Follow
Elon Musk took over @Twitter, but he's still the CEO of @Tesla. That raises legal concerns — is he creating conflicts of interest? Is he misappropriating company resources? Tesla is not Musk’s private plaything. I’ve got many questions for the Tesla Board.

One name: Sam Bankman-Fried