Nürburgring aka 'Green Hell' (visiting) advice and footage

[Dackelone]

Misha aka Boosted Boris(formly from Ring Garage) now works for APEX. They not only have the best deals on rental race cars for the Ring but they also have a hotel just a few hundred meters from the Ring TF entrance. You might want to check APEX out.


I think IF I were gonna rent a car for the track(definitely the way to go bc doing it in your own car is way too risky) I would look into APEX. They currently have a M2 and a 218i moung other interesting cars. The 218 has been tuned putting out 200 hp and has some small mods done to it. They also have the cheapest/best deal on Ring rentals... namely their VW Polo - which was crashed recently. But now they have a Polo GTi. They have may cars to choose from RWD or FWD... take a look at their fleet of rentals.

APEX also runs a hotel in Nurburg so its basically all in one. You will just need a regular rental car when you fly into Frankfurt(2 hours away or Munich five and half hours drive - to the Ring) to get to the Ring.

Apex's rental car price list...
http://www.apex-nuerburg.com/wp-cont...-cars_July.pdf

You DON'T want to rent a car from SIXT/Europcar/AVIS or any other place and take it to the 'Ring. The rental car companies have spotters at the track and cameras. IF your caught you will NEVER be able to rental a car in Germany from anyone. Get a Ring rental from a good company. And take out extra insurance - just in case something happens.

[TYSP33D]

"RENT A BUGGY, OR A DISABILITY CARRIAGE" LMAO! Probably so very true. I would imagine the first few laps- no matter how many you have done in virtual reality are so intense, you could be riding a bicycle and it would be scary.

[spellbmw]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

I would love to hear some stories of people trips to the 'Ring... good or bad.

Hey, Dackelone,

It. Was. AWESOME!! Had to face my fear of the car eating 'Ring, but with my 2018 M2, hit the track and stayed to the right until I felt comfortable. By the time it was done, I was hollering like a kid on a great carnival ride. It was a Sunday in October 2017 on the day before my return to Munich to leave the car off with the shipper. By the time I got to the 'Ring, the car already had 3000 miles on it from my 17 days of driving and the 'Ring was a fitting high point from which to descend back to Munich & home to Oregon. I will never forget the experience and am glad I faced my fear & left the track smiling.

Thanks for all your posts over the years. Really appreciate your dedication to the forums.
Scott

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by spellbmw

Hey, Dackelone,

It. Was. AWESOME!!

Nice to hear that!

Dackel

[Z K]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

Misha aka Boosted Boris(formly from Ring Garage) now works for APEX. They not only have the best deals on rental race cars for the Ring but they also have a hotel just a few hundred meters from the Ring TF entrance. You might want to check APEX out.


I think IF I were gonna rent a car for the track(definitely the way to go bc doing it in your own car is way too risky) I would look into APEX. They currently have a M2 and a 218i moung other interesting cars. The 218 has been tuned putting out 200 hp and has some small mods done to it. They also have the cheapest/best deal on Ring rentals... namely their VW Polo - which was crashed recently. But now they have a Polo GTi. They have may cars to choose from RWD or FWD... take a look at their fleet of rentals.

APEX also runs a hotel in Nurburg so its basically all in one. You will just need a regular rental car when you fly into Frankfurt(2 hours away or Munich five and half hours drive - to the Ring) to get to the Ring.

Apex's rental car price list...
http://www.apex-nuerburg.com/wp-cont...-cars_July.pdf

You DON'T want to rent a car from SIXT/Europcar/AVIS or any other place and take it to the 'Ring. The rental car companies have spotters at the track and cameras. IF your caught you will NEVER be able to rental a car in Germany from anyone. Get a Ring rental from a good company. And take out extra insurance - just in case something happens.

My last trip to the ring, I rented from another ring rental group. Misha's prices seem a bit pricey so I didn't get it from him. I did a few laps with an instructor and it was still less expensive than just renting the car from Apex.

While not advisable, I also did laps in my regular rental car. From what I heard from a few people I talked to, the rental car companies usually look for their sports cars that people rent and take to the ring. My entry level diesel economy car was not something they look for. Of course, if you do get into an accident, you can be in big trouble. I drove conservatively and had a few scouting laps before my ring rental.

[Dackelone]

[inTgr8r]

Hey Dackel, do you know where one could order that map^ (or similar)
I tried to find one last time I was there and struck out.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

Hey Dackel, do you know where one could order that map^ (or similar)
I tried to find one last time I was there and struck out.

I think I have seen those maps sold either at the ED Tankstelle(gas station, known as ED)

www,doettinger-hoehe.de

Or it might have been at the 'Ring fan gift shop inside the 'Ring Werk area... next to the Subway and next to the 'Ring Museum...

http://www.nuerburgring.de/en/drives.../ringshop.html


I tried searching and couldn't find that 'Ring map. But I have seen them before. I did find these...



http://www.nuerburgring-shop.de/1530...99-poster.html


http://www.nuerburgring-shop.de/reli...123500999.html


IF you are just looking for the corner names... this is a good source...

NORDSCHLEIFE > Sections of the track, names
http://www.nuerburgring.de/en/fans-i...the-track.html


Perhaps try asking RSR, or Dale Lomas at BtG or Misha at Apex if they would know where to get a copy of this 'Ring Map.

good luck,
Dackel

[inTgr8r]

Thanks, Ill try RSR.
That's who I rented through when I was there.

I'd like to get one and have it plaque mounted for the garage.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by inTgr8r

Thanks, Ill try RSR.
That's who I rented through when I was there.

I'd like to get one and have it plaque mounted for the garage.

Cool.


Sometimes you have to get creative... many moons ago I was at the 'Ring with Rikx1M and we were looking for some 'Ring memorabilia... we couldn't really find a track map. But I saw this 'Ring shopping bag with a digitally printed 'Ring map on it for 18 euros. It was way over priced... but it was cool. We bought it and I cut off the stitches and made a poster out of the bag. Rick and I split the cost of the bag. I still have it hanging up on my 'Ring poster wall... eight years later. And Rick and I are still friends.


Framed 'Ring shopping bag...

[Dackelone]

Just a PSA for those headed to the 'Ring this year. The track opened last weekend... and already the Green Hell has claimed some victims. Car-Friday held in two weeks on Good Friday will be the season opener for the 'Ring. The masses will be there on Friday. But everyone should read/watch this video...

Here is the same crash pile up from a guy in a e30 just ahead of the GT3 driver...

Dale at BtG did a nice write up about this video...

https://www.bridgetogantry.com/video...ed-the-advice/


Stay Safe...
Dackel

[GuidoK]

OMG what a story, what a crash.
Ok, 200kph+ blind corners is of course a risk.
Grüne Hölle is after all an earned reputation.

Not parking before but after a crash is a good advice though. At one moment you think you're helping by warning others, the next moment you see your car being torpedoed by a red GT3RS at high speed. I wonder how insurance companies are going to solve this one... (probably in their own interest )

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

OMG what a story, what a crash.
Ok, 200kph+ blind corners is of course a risk.
Grüne Hölle is after all an earned reputation.

Not parking before but after a crash is a good advice though. At one moment you think you're helping by warning others, the next moment you see your car being torpedoed by a red GT3RS at high speed. I wonder how insurance companies are going to solve this one... (probably in their own interest )

In Germany(Europe), it is always the car from behind who pays... this accident's damages was around ~1.5 Million euros in damages. The cause of the accident was from another Porsche who leaked coolant onto the track... that car had been inspected by a Porsche dealer just before the guy went to the 'Ring... so that dealer is also on the hook for damages. I'm sure it will be in the legal systems for years. At least no one was killed.


You can read in the comments in his YT link...

TurboMoz
3 hours ago
can you please explain who did insurance went after for the damage? the guy who lost his coolant? was he responsible?

GT3 driver wrote...

sebastian vittel
2 hours ago
That is a very nice question ;-)
The insurance of each car pay their customer (that was my case, because i haved full insurance recovery include on track) after it depend of each contract, of the warranty included etc...
After that made and because 15 cars was involved in the accident and the total cost of the accident is close to 1.5million € they will do some expert investigation during this year to get the percent of fault of each driver (for exemple me 20%, the coolant porsche 50%, the audi tt 10% etc and they will attack each other on this way to reduce the cost for each insurance company
If for exemple the porsche who loosed the coolant was not correctly checked by the dealer and has one defect on the coolant flexible, the insurance of this porsche will need to pay more percent, 80% instead 50%, depend of the investigation

Kind of ironic the GT3 driver's user name! lol

Dackel

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

You can read in the comments in his YT link...



GT3 driver wrote...



Kind of ironic the GT3 driver's user name! lol

Dackel

Yeah but that is his own explanation/interpretation. I cant imagine that the insurance companies already made up their minds and refunded/paid for the damage. As long as no money is transferred its all speculation I think

[EvoFire]

Thank you for the thread, this has been a very useful read, especially the part about the ring open everyday I was under that impression while planning the trip for this Sept.

Just curious, how dangerous is it to putter around at say a moderate speed? What are the chances of some idiot rear ending me?

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

Thank you for the thread, this has been a very useful read, especially the part about the ring open everyday I was under that impression while planning the trip for this Sept.

Just curious, how dangerous is it to putter around at say a moderate speed? What are the chances of some idiot rear ending me?

You can get a "feel" for how fast the cars are out on the track by watching who and what kinds of cars go out on TF sessions. You will see... the "vibe" can be electric especially after a track closure and then all the nuts want to be first to be out again. I usually wait a half and hour or so.

As far as taking it slow... that is what TF(tourist Fahrt) is all about. You can have VANS or BUSES or RV's out with semi race cars and fast street cars. Just remember to stay to the RIGHT and out your right turn signal on so the over taking car knows you have seen them.


Here is a good video from a few days ago... showing how a fast car CAN get around the 'Ring when slower cars are on TF...

Dackel

[Z K]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

In Germany(Europe), it is always the car from behind who pays... this accident's damages was around ~1.5 Million euros in damages. The cause of the accident was from another Porsche who leaked coolant onto the track... that car had been inspected by a Porsche dealer just before the guy went to the 'Ring... so that dealer is also on the hook for damages. I'm sure it will be in the legal systems for years. At least no one was killed.

911s before the 991 models were notorious for blowing off the coolant hose. It is a very common problem with these cars. The coolant hose is attached via this metal sleeve that is glued together. Over time and heat this fails. It is a very terrible design. Gluing a part together that is subject to high heat and stress?

The aftermarket solution is to pin or weld the metal together so it doesn't fall apart.

[Captain Blood]

I had forgotten all about this track until this popped up today.
Sounds like a bucket list item. I've been very, very fast on this track
(in Granturismo, of course).

[GuidoK]

Originally Posted by EvoFire

Just curious, how dangerous is it to putter around at say a moderate speed? What are the chances of some idiot rear ending me?

I think this depends very much on how busy it is and who's on the track.
During touristenfahrten there are I think 2 things that play: fast guys that can drive really well and know the track and beginners that dont know the track and will make mistakes.
So you can always think: if the beginner makes a mistake, its his fault.
But you can also think: an experienced driver should be able to spot a beginner and assess the situation accordingly (by maybe not overtaking)

This is a nice example, and when its busy on the ring (this was on a very busy day, I was in a 1 hour traffic jam before I could go on the ring (just after a big accident), you'll see something like this every lap (either you're causing it or it happens just in front of your nose )

The sponsored car probably has an experienced driver, the red car not so much.
Nothing really dangerous is happening here (apart from me getting a load of stonechips... ), but still its the same as you driving on the highway at highway speed and getting forced into the border by someone.

[Dackelone]

GuidoK Yup, you never know who you are driving next too or over taking on the 'Ring.

Do you remember the BP forum member who used his horn and flashed his lights at every car he was approaching... just to be "safe". I wish I could remember his user name. I just remember he drove a e92 M3 around the 'Ring.


For me, driving the 'Ring always reminds me of this cult video.... "Ruf Faszination" shot back in 1988!! Stefan the driver would only get three for four laps out of brand new tires driving this way. This video sold a lot of VHS & DVD's AND Yellow Birds for Alois Ruf. qdtjant and I had the pleasure of meeting Mr Ruf, a few years back.... such a nice guy.

[jeffkukuruda]

I can tell you from experience the Ring can be a very expensive venture! I have been to Germany many times, but in the summer of 2016 I finally planned a trip focusing on getting there, along with first watching the Belgian Grand Prix, followed two days at the Ring and then a few days in Stuttgart for Summer Wine Fest.
I have an e39 M5 and rented an E92 M3 from RSR (having owned many BMW's and wanting to drive something similar power wise to what I owned), the instructor was great and the experience and laps are truly a lifelong memory. The reason my trip was SO expensive is because I fell in love with the E9X M3 and bought one shortly after getting back from the trip. It's very similar to the car I rented there. The rental was an alpine white E92, speed cloth, DCT. I ended up buying an e90 alpine white, slicktop, speed cloth, DCT. If you have the means to go there and do it right, you will not regret it! The place is magical. You can sense how special the place is and all the history is amazing compared to newer race tracks.

Cheers,
Jeff

[drunkuncas]

Nice writeup