Fatal accident 26/2 on a Greek highway ... RIP

[FD3S]

The video is terrifying but reminds me what separates life from death are some seconds. What was truly sad for me, is that the local media and the social media cannibalised the family of the driver because he was one of the most wealthy guys in here. Stupidity at it is best moments!

Many days now that I have seen this thread I was wondering if it makes sense to ask some questions but I am almost sure I knew the answer. But after the post of AntDX316 I said to give it a try.

What you can do in a similar situation? Lets say that you are with a high speed an a tire blows. Is there any change to survive?
Makes any difference if you have the electronics on or off?
What happens in case a tire blows and is in the front axle?
Or the whole thing is doomed once it happens?

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by FD3S

The video is terrifying but reminds me what separates life from death are some seconds. What was truly sad for me, is that the local media and the social media cannibalised the family of the driver because he was one of the most wealthy guys in here. Stupidity at it is best moments!

Many days now that I have seen this thread I was wondering if it makes sense to ask some questions but I am almost sure I knew the answer. But after the post of AntDX316 I said to give it a try.

What you can do in a similar situation? Lets say that you are with a high speed an a tire blows. Is there any change to survive?
Makes any difference if you have the electronics on or off?
What happens in case a tire blows and is in the front axle?
Or the whole thing is doomed once it happens?

No recovery was possible in this accident sequence. Both the Vehicle Systems and the driver initiated appropriate control inputs, but the car suffered too much damage at a speed which guaranteed a fatal end.

A "normal" rear tire failure in a 911 at 200mph is startling but easily controlled as shown in the vid. This accident did not have a normal failure mode unfortunately.

[FD3S]

Originally Posted by lemetier

No recovery was possible in this accident sequence. Both the Vehicle Systems and the driver initiated appropriate control inputs, but the car suffered too much damage at a speed which guaranteed a fatal end.

A "normal" rear tire failure in a 911 at 200mph is startling but easily controlled as shown in the vid. This accident did not have a normal failure mode unfortunately.

Lemetier what caused this severe damage? What makes the case of the GT2 so different? Could be the rainy weather?

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by Blacktan

Latest details ,

Driver was 24 years old
Mud & Snow Tyres on car with DOT 4806 production
87Y speed indication

Driving on ten year old tires. Yikes!

Any tire that is older than four or five year's should be tossed. I guess there is a reason why our TUV is so stringent over here in the Land of high speed Autobahns.

[FD3S]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

Driving on ten year old tires. Yikes!

Any tire that is older than four or five year's should be tossed. I guess there is a reason why our TUV is so stringent over here in the Land of high speed Autobahns.

My personal thoughts about this issue is that the car was dad's car and he was not using it often so he never looked about the tires.

Second case those guys have employees who run after their cars to maintain them. They usually use to put used parts and invoice them for new to pocket the difference.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by FD3S

Lemetier what caused this severe damage? What makes the case of the GT2 so different? Could be the rainy weather?

Improper Specification tires in unserviceable condition. ETRTO has specific failure mode requirements and this tire failed in the opposite and most dangerous way. The load rating was 49% of the minimum needed at 130km/h. The failure occurred at over 300km/h. The interior side wall was compressed against the wheel flange causing a full circumference fracture. Because this camber compression was in the opposite direction required, it pulled the fractured carcass towards the centerline at an angle. It then impacted and became snared on the thrust control arm causing a severe change in toe angle. The carcass then twisted inside out and exited the rear. This produced a large hole in the bodywork open to the direction of the spin, which caused aerodynamic lift. This all occurred in under 0.5 seconds. 0.4seconds later, the car was entering the rest area with final impact in 0.9 seconds from there. The engine continued an additional 451m.

The rain did have an effect, but this was going to be fatal irregardless.

The GT2 on the other hand hit debris causing a puncture and deformed as designed, allowing for reasonable directional stability to be maintained.

Originally Posted by Dackelone

Driving on ten year old tires. Yikes!

Any tire that is older than four or five year's should be tossed. I guess there is a reason why our TUV is so stringent over here in the Land of high speed Autobahns.

There are going to be some inquiries as to why a Porsche purchased and serviced at Zentrum Bielefeld was involved in a fatal accident in Greece made worse by unserviceable and incompatible USED US DOT Snow tires being installed on the car.

[Umi|all|day]

The rain played a huge role, this GTR blew its front passenger tire at 200mph & still came to a safe stop. He didn't panick at all either, basically let the car slow down its self without getting on the breaks. Blowing a tire on wet roads at that speed is bound to be fatal.. if you can't get the car's force back in control those first few seconds it's a goner.

[FD3S]

Originally Posted by lemetier

Improper Specification tires in unserviceable condition. ETRTO has specific failure mode requirements and this tire failed in the opposite and most dangerous way. The load rating was 49% of the minimum needed at 130km/h. The failure occurred at over 300km/h. The interior side wall was compressed against the wheel flange causing a full circumference fracture. Because this camber compression was in the opposite direction required, it pulled the fractured carcass towards the centerline at an angle. It then impacted and became snared on the thrust control arm causing a severe change in toe angle. The carcass then twisted inside out and exited the rear. This produced a large hole in the bodywork open to the direction of the spin, which caused aerodynamic lift. This all occurred in under 0.5 seconds. 0.4seconds later, the car was entering the rest area with final impact in 0.9 seconds from there. The engine continued an additional 451m.

The rain did have an effect, but this was going to be fatal irregardless.

The GT2 on the other hand hit debris causing a puncture and deformed as designed, allowing for reasonable directional stability to be maintained.



There are going to be some inquiries as to why a Porsche purchased and serviced at Zentrum Bielefeld was involved in a fatal accident in Greece made worse by unserviceable and incompatible USED US DOT Snow tires being installed on the car.

Very detailed answer. Thank you.

I wonder how do you know all those things. I hope he was not relative or friend. In any case rip for all of them.

On the media there was also an "expert" that he was saying in this accident if the tire blew 2 meters before or 0.5 before it would never have entered the parking. Makes you wonder...

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by FD3S

Very detailed answer. Thank you.

I wonder how do you know all those things. I hope he was not relative or friend. In any case rip for all of them.

On the media there was also an "expert" that he was saying that this accident if the tire blew 2 meters before or 0.5 before it would never have entered the parking. Makes you wonder...

He was a friend (lived in Miami and was in Greece for spring break when this occurred). I'm also an accredited expert for wheels/tires and human behavior during high performance driving. I wanted to know more for professional reasons as well.

The secondary EDR attached to the roll-over protection system survived.

There's numerous "if only" that may have prevented a family from losing a mother and child. They likely were unaware and thankfully died instantly without suffering.

George and the unbelted passenger never stood a chance. Once the tire went, recovery was impossible, and the impact location would mean their death..

[FD3S]

My condolences Lemetier.

[Igor_M5]

Originally Posted by lemetier

He was a friend (lived in Miami and was in Greece for spring break when this occurred). I'm also an accredited expert for wheels/tires and human behavior during high performance driving. I wanted to know more for professional reasons as well.

The secondary EDR attached to the roll-over protection system survived.

There's numerous "if only" that may have prevented a family from losing a mother and child. They likely were unaware and thankfully died instantly without suffering.

George and the unbelted passenger never stood a chance. Once the tire went, recovery was impossible, and the impact location would mean their death..

So sorry for your loss man.

At the moment, I'm not sure what I'm more floored by, the wrong time, wrong place freak accident, or the mind blowing knowledge your extremely interesting profession allows you to possess. All aside the unfortunate fact that the two coincided with the loss of your friend. WOW.

[AntDX316]

Originally Posted by lemetier

Your posts have reached a level of ignorant arrogance and disillusioned nature, it's amazing you are actually allowed in society.

I'm sending a warning to everyone and ways to prevent such disaster because Hell is real and he can't come back to tell you I am right about what I said and all the other people who messed up due to not doing what I said. I'm just trying to prevent people from going there though the lack of doing more when you have method. I don't opt-in to health insurance because the system is kind of broken. They don't teach how to address deficiencies but instead give solutions to remedy the symptoms but turning signs off. Also, it's like working out where you don't go hard enough w/ the weights then when sheer brute force impact hits your joints break but would have been strengthened years before had you did the correct heavy workouts and nutrient implementation. You say I'm ignorant arrogance and disillusioned nature but I've looked up and tested/proven my beliefs time and time again. Had your friend met someone like me before then his accident would have been averted.

[JamesGames]

Originally Posted by AntDX316

No matter how skillful you are always leave some stability control on in real-life.

Always check tire pressure, brush up on driver skill w/ the vehicle to understand limits every month if you are wealthy. Keep your vehicle maintained. Of course they were burned beyond recognition for the ability to test for drugs/alch in the system. I drift very good in the snow but one time I was somewhat drunk and I messed up a correction. There was no telephone pole where I went up on the grass hill. I realized when drunk, your senses can be warped and a sense you easily have when "normal" is stretched. Stretched as in you think you got it but you don't such as a quick reflex to recenter the wheel but instead the angle of the steering is off a bit causing an unwanted momentum shift no matter how many times practiced. The finessing just may not exist when you need it the most. If you want to find out and you have a track and vehicle to work w/ in a controlled environment try doing some "maneuvers" both sober and intoxicated and compare your performance results. Like what happened in this video, I've seen NDE Hell videos of people telling their experience and if the driver is trapped in that car for all eternity they would have wished they met someone like me and taken what I said seriously given they were wealthy enough to do everything I said. As for the poor people who cannot afford... shouldn't even be racing in the first place unless you religiously practice on simulator settings in Forza and GT w/ a good force feedback wheel pedal set.

Originally Posted by AntDX316

I'm sending a warning to everyone and ways to prevent such disaster because Hell is real and he can't come back to tell you I am right about what I said and all the other people who messed up due to not doing what I said. I'm just trying to prevent people from going there though the lack of doing more when you have method. I don't opt-in to health insurance because the system is kind of broken. They don't teach how to address deficiencies but instead give solutions to remedy the symptoms but turning signs off. Also, it's like working out where you don't go hard enough w/ the weights then when sheer brute force impact hits your joints break but would have been strengthened years before had you did the correct heavy workouts and nutrient implementation. You say I'm ignorant arrogance and disillusioned nature but I've looked up and tested/proven my beliefs time and time again. Had your friend met someone like me before then his accident would have been averted.

..........

Go home you're drunk.