When will Max win his first championship?

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

MAX didn't get many chances in his short career , because +/- 97% of the races were dry races.

I remember 3 wet races ..
Brazil 2016 => P2
Germany 2019 => P1
Turkey 2020 => DNF

Climate changes , heat waves and droughts are the game breaker ..
Hope that will change as well..

My friend, there have been at least 10 since Max started...perhaps more. HAM has prevailed in all but one. Since 2014 he has won every wet event but Germany 2019.

HAM is the true rainmeister. No one better. This is a true test of skill that no one can match.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

My friend, there have been at least 10 since Max started...perhaps more. HAM has prevailed in all but one. Since 2014 he has won every wet event but Germany 2019.

HAM is the true rainmeister. No one better. This is a true test of skill that no one can match.

Since MAX started ? At least 10 in the rain ? I don't think so...

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Since MAX started ? At least 10 in the rain ? I don't think so...

You are literally missing 3 years.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

You are literally missing 3 years.

That's correct . In the last 3 years we only got rain in Germany 2019 and Turkey 2020 .
As I said in Turkey 2020 there was more oil than rain .

Off-Topic :
That's what we can see in the last 3 years , even over here in Belgium we got crazy heat waves , crazy hot temps. and lack of water ...
Honestly ..I'm not religious . But the first rain after the drought was like a gift from God !
My lawn was burned completely by the sun like in the Sahara ! On my terrace I saw 52° C in the sun !
Last year the Belgian water supply in my region was a disaster , my water tap was several times empty for days . Just a few drips of water !
The groundwater reserve was gone ...
After work I had to wash myself with bottles of Evian water ...

Last year I posted pics from the Belgian landscape ....Dust , Parched rivers and lakes !

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

That's correct . In the last 3 years we only got rain in Germany 2019 and Turkey 2020 .
As I said in Turkey 2020 there was more oil than rain .

Off-Topic :
That's what we can see in the last 3 years , even over here in Belgium we got crazy heat waves , crazy hot temps. and lack of water ...
Honestly ..I'm not religious . But the first rain after the drought was like a gift from God !
My lawn was burned completely by the sun like in the Sahara ! On my terrace I saw 52° C in the sun !
Last year the Belgian water supply in my region was a disaster , my water tap was several times empty for days . Just a few drips of water !
The groundwater reserve was gone ...
After work I had to wash myself with bottles of Evian water ...

Last year I posted pics from the Belgian landscape ....Dust , Parched rivers and lakes !

My friend, there are thing far more important than racing and I'm so sorry to hear of these tribulations. It saddens me that you and your countrymen have been so beset upon the last few years. I'll never forget the videos you placed on the highway where all of those people were crowding buses, scaring commuters and the like. Horrible.

No matter how much we may bicker here, I truly wish you to be safe and sound.

Kindest Regaards-mk

[Autobacs]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

Was the bet agreed?...I recall you proposed something but I don't recall MKsixer accepting.

See post #100 on predictions for 2021 F1 season thread.

[Autobacs]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

I bet they are.

On both 2017 and 2018, VET should have won both of those championships. Had ALO or HAM been in the car Ferrari would have broken the string of Mercedes championships. But HAM broke VET in those years. I hope VET can make a return to form at Aston Martin!!

This I agree if ALO had been in the Ferrari. VET was definitely broken by HAM.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

My friend, there are thing far more important than racing and I'm so sorry to hear of these tribulations. It saddens me that you and your countrymen have been so beset upon the last few years. I'll never forget the videos you placed on the highway where all of those people were crowding buses, scaring commuters and the like. Horrible.

No matter how much we may bicker here, I truly wish you to be safe and sound.

Kindest Regaards-mk

Well thank you my good friend !
Honestly , I really appreciate your kind words !

Stay save and healthy my friend , and I wish you the best of luck from my side !

Note : May the best win in this season ....

[rcracin]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

That's correct . In the last 3 years we only got rain in Germany 2019 and Turkey 2020 .
As I said in Turkey 2020 there was more oil than rain .

Off-Topic :
That's what we can see in the last 3 years , even over here in Belgium we got crazy heat waves , crazy hot temps. and lack of water ...
Honestly ..I'm not religious . But the first rain after the drought was like a gift from God !
My lawn was burned completely by the sun like in the Sahara ! On my terrace I saw 52° C in the sun !
Last year the Belgian water supply in my region was a disaster , my water tap was several times empty for days . Just a few drips of water !
The groundwater reserve was gone ...
After work I had to wash myself with bottles of Evian water ...

Last year I posted pics from the Belgian landscape ....Dust , Parched rivers and lakes !

That's crazy. The things we take for granted. I have no idea what that would be like. Even when we lose electricity, we usually don't lose gas so we can have heating and cooking. But loss of water is something I've never experienced.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by rcracin

That's crazy. The things we take for granted. I have no idea what that would be like. Even when we lose electricity, we usually don't lose gas so we can have heating and cooking. But loss of water is something I've never experienced.

Indeed mate !

Off-Topic (sorry guys)

It's very clear that we are dealing with a climate change , and during the summer It's going really fast in the last 2-3 years !
In Flemish (Dutch) => https://www.noodweer.be/hoe-droog-wa...n-de-gevolgen/

Just to show you , check the date ...May 11 , 2020 .

[MKSixer]

After being stuck on a count of 3 for Max winning in 2021, it seems that testing has brought up the total by 67% to 5.

I, for one, can't wait for the fight and relish the opportunity to see how the first race goes.

Note: Mercedes was running over 60KG of fuel and RBR was running about 40KG during testing.

Looking forward to the contest!!

[e90335e36m3]

IMO, the superior engineering and technology that has allowed HAM achieve what he has, period. He would still win if he was in a Red Bull but nowhere near as much. Fact: Unless there is a level playing field, statistics (e.g. wins, qualifiers, etc.) whether HAM or Verstappen is better are irrelevant. Ham's statistics are attached to asterisks.

*Only won in a Mercedes. Mercedes technology/engineering, like the Ferrari of Schumacher was superior at the time to any other competitor. How did Schumacher do after he came out of a retirement?

*Drove same Mercedes newbie driver George Russell sat in at the last moment and basically won in the first time he drove it.

Barry Bonds hit more home runs than Babe Ruth in one season. However, we all know the steroids and steroids administration today are better than those Ruth had access to. I'd only be expressing an opinion by saying Bonds is better based on "statistics". It's not a level playing field, period.

Only way we will ever know is if we put both in the same car, with no competing interests, same crews, same conditions etc. If that were to happen, in my opinion, Verstappen, Schumacher, Senna, Russell, would wipe the floor with HAM, who'd be too busy instagramming and social justicing.

[SenorFunkyPants]

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

If that were to happen, in my opinion, Verstappen, Schumacher, Senna, Russell, would wipe the floor with HAM,

Senna maybe at a similar level or perhaps a tad better...no floor wiping though.
Schumacher probably not...he never raced with a competitive team mate so can't 100% sure.
Russell unlikely but can't be certain until he sits alongside Hamilton in 2022...he may have the speed but not the experience.
Verstappen definitely not...but even if yes he would still be behind Ricciardo.

[e90335e36m3]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

Senna maybe.
Schumacher probably not...he never raced with a competitive team mate so can't 100% sure.
Russell unlikely but can't be certain until he sits alongside Hamilton in 2022...he may have the speed but not the experience.
Verstappen definitely not...but even if yes he would still be behind Ricciardo.

A valid opinion. My main point was to say that whenever statistics are used to turn opinions to facts in F1, I chuckle. I wonder how many wins you can take away from Hamilton by virtue of team orders. At least one I know of, in Sochi. That's a perfect example of even being on the same team doesn't necessarily create an equal playing field. Hamilton has always been the beneficiary of better pit strategies, better crews, more focus. The other guy is there just to help him win.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

IMO, the superior engineering and technology that has allowed HAM achieve what he has, period. He would still win if he was in a Red Bull but nowhere near as much. Fact: Unless there is a level playing field, statistics (e.g. wins, qualifiers, etc.) whether HAM or Verstappen is better are irrelevant. Ham's statistics are attached to asterisks.

*Only won in a Mercedes. Mercedes technology/engineering, like the Ferrari of Schumacher was superior at the time to any other competitor. How did Schumacher do after he came out of a retirement?

*Drove same Mercedes newbie driver George Russell sat in at the last moment and basically won in the first time he drove it.

Barry Bonds hit more home runs than Babe Ruth in one season. However, we all know the steroids and steroids administration today are better than those Ruth had access to. I'd only be expressing an opinion by saying Bonds is better based on "statistics". It's not a level playing field, period.

Only way we will ever know is if we put both in the same car, with no competing interests, same crews, same conditions etc. If that were to happen, in my opinion, Verstappen, Schumacher, Senna, Russell, would wipe the floor with HAM, who'd be too busy instagramming and social justicing.

Thank you for, once again, confirming that there are people who watch F1 and know nothing about it.

HAM Statistics at McLaren from 2007 to 2012

Total Race Wins: 21 of the 33 race wins. That's 64%
Total Pole Positions: 26 of 30 pole positions. That's 87%


The competition: Alonso...beat him in 2007. KOV...beat him in 2008 and 2009. BUT...beat him in 2010, lost in 2011 and beat him in 2012.

HAM has 6 years at McLaren and dusted his teammates. I guess you think ALO is a slap-dick since HAM beat him...correct? What's your opinion on BUT? Must be slap-dick, as well.

There isn't a driver in the modern history of F1 who has faced the competition that HAM has but for PRO, SEN, PIQ and LAU.

[e90335e36m3]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Thank you for, once again, confirming that there are people who watch F1 and know nothing about it.

HAM Statistics at McLaren from 2007 to 2012

Total Race Wins: 21 of the 33 race wins. That's 64%
Total Pole Positions: 26 of 30 pole positions. That's 87%


The competition: Alonso...beat him in 2007. KOV...beat him in 2008 and 2009. BUT...beat him in 2010, lost in 2011 and beat him in 2012.

HAM has 6 years at McLaren and dusted his teammates. I guess you think ALO is a slap-dick since HAM beat him...correct? What's your opinion on BUT? Must be slap-dick, as well.

There isn't a driver in the modern history of F1 who has faced the competition that HAM has but for PRO, SEN, PIQ and LAU.

You can't disagree that a truly objective assessment of capability requires everything else to be constant. Other sports like boxing and judo at least try to do it in some capacity.

F1 makes no such attempts. It is renown for its politics and the fact that $$$ usually dictates who wins and who loses.

I know that any comparison of Hamilton with Verstappen triggers you. So I'll take his name out of the equation and state again more generally that I believe that one cannot make a meaningful comparison of a driver's capabilities in F1 because it is inherently one of the most unfair unequal playing fields in all of sports. Ask the Haas team, or Sergio Perez who by your own statistical definition is a better driver than his teammate but got canned because he's not the son of the billionaire owner.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

You can't disagree that a truly objective assessment of capability requires everything else to be constant. Other sports like boxing and judo at least try to do it in some capacity.

F1 makes no such attempts. It is renown for its politics and the fact that $$$ usually dictates who wins and who loses.

I know that any comparison of Hamilton with Verstappen triggers you. So I'll take his name out of the equation and state again more generally that I believe that one cannot make a meaningful comparison of a driver's capabilities in F1 because it is inherently one of the most unfair unequal playing fields in all of sports. Ask the Haas team, or Sergio Perez who by your own statistical definition is a better driver than his teammate but got canned because he's not the son of the billionaire owner.

Firstly, a comparison of VER and HAM is the highest level of sophistry. VER has only raced against RIC and didn't do so well. His competition have been shrubs.

HAM has seen off everyone he has raced against, overall.

Will you address your statement that HAM has never won?

[e90335e36m3]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

Firstly, a comparison of VER and HAM is the highest level of sophistry. VER has only raced against RIC and didn't do so well. His competition have been shrubs.

HAM has seen off everyone he has raced against, overall.

Will you address your statement that HAM has never won?

I don't think I said Hamilton never won. He won in conjunction with superior technology which makes his win an asterisk.

Again my only intent all along has been to say that you cannot make an objective comparison without an objective basis. If you cited statistics for NASCAR, I'd be more amenable to accepting your argument. F1 and equal grounds are mutually exclusive.

If you don't want to accept that fine.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

I don't think I said Hamilton never won. He won in conjunction with superior technology which makes his win an asterisk.

Again my only intent all along has been to say that you cannot make an objective comparison without an objective basis. If you cited statistics for NASCAR, I'd be more amenable to accepting your argument. F1 and equal grounds are mutually exclusive.

If you don't want to accept that fine.

"*Only won in a Mercedes. Mercedes technology/engineering..."

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

After being stuck on a count of 3 for Max winning in 2021, it seems that testing has brought up the total by 67% to 5.

I, for one, can't wait for the fight and relish the opportunity to see how the first race goes.

Note: Mercedes was running over 60KG of fuel and RBR was running about 40KG during testing.

Looking forward to the contest!!

Merc had no choice but to use more fuel as any less would have rendered the 12 almost undriveable with the errant back end.

[SenorFunkyPants]

Originally Posted by e90335e36m3

A valid opinion. My main point was to say that whenever statistics are used to turn opinions to facts in F1, I chuckle. I wonder how many wins you can take away from Hamilton by virtue of team orders. At least one I know of, in Sochi. That's a perfect example of even being on the same team doesn't necessarily create an equal playing field. Hamilton has always been the beneficiary of better pit strategies, better crews, more focus. The other guy is there just to help him win.

Its my understanding that:
Hamilton and Bottas have the same equipment.
Alternate who goes on track first during qualifying
Have access to each others settings and performance data
Have the same tyre strategy...which can not be changed to allow one driver to jump the other with an under or overcut pitstop.

That being said, Toto isn't stupid, he knows that Hamilton is the faster driver (and in his view the fastest driver in F1) of the two and far more likely to win championships so if there are any 50:50 calls they will certainly go in Hamiltons favour.
The call to Bottas to let Hamilton past at Sochi was unnecessary and was regretted in retrospect by the team...Myself I hate any sort of team orders, if you can't win by talent then thats tough.
If McLaren had applied team orders for one race in 2007, Hamilton would have won the drivers championship as a rookie...and I respect McLaren for not doing so, despite the cost to the team.

[e90335e36m3]

Originally Posted by MKSixer

"*Only won in a Mercedes. Mercedes technology/engineering..."

He's good at switching to the then most tech advanced teams.

Ham's wins*

*Driver was the beneficiary of significant technological "steroids" compared to peers.