Integra coming back

[freakystyly]

Originally Posted by Donatello.

Looks good. How heavy is it? What are the 0-60 & 1/4 numbers?
Faster than an Elantra N?

5 more hp and 30 lbs heavier than the CTR. So basically the same but less ugly.

Yes faster 0-60 than the N.

[XutvJet]

I'm pleasantly surprised. Look forward to seeing one in person. The exhaust is a bit ridiculous though. Perhaps painting it all flat black would help.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by Burrcold

Love the look although I wish the fender flares were actually integrated into the sheet metal and not stuck on.

It looks like they are integrated from some of the close up photos.

[Donatello.]

Originally Posted by freakystyly

5 more hp and 30 lbs heavier than the CTR. So basically the same but less ugly.

Yes faster 0-60 than the N.

Same suspension as CTR then?

[Donatello.]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

$48-50k for a type s integra is going to be very tough to swallow.

52k will get you a loaded m240i. i get the integra will have a slick manual and the 240 has a slushbox. but rwd and b58 are a hard combo to pass up when the competitor is a fwd 4 cylinder. i'll have to drive one first though, all the reviewers and chris harris are raving about the type r

Based on what this thing costs, and what else is available for the same $, it is out of the running for potential new DD for my wife. A shame.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

It looks like they are integrated from some of the close up photos.

Only on the bumper pieces. On the fenders and doors they are tacked on.

You can see the separation of the flare and the door on the one on the right side.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by Burrcold

Only on the bumper pieces. On the fenders and doors they are tacked on.

I looked again and it looks like the rear flares are add-on. Better than nothing but doesn't look as good as integrated flares.

[Burrcold]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

I looked again and it looks like the rear flares are add-on. Better than nothing but doesn't look as good as integrated flares.

Oh definitely. I still think it looks great!

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by Donatello.

Looks good. How heavy is it? What are the 0-60 & 1/4 numbers?
Faster than an Elantra N?

In a recent MOTORTREND article the Integra Type S weighs in at 3,219 lbs. MOTORTREND has the Civic Type R (FL5) 0-60 time and 1/4 mile time as 5.3 seconds 13.9 seconds, respectively so I presume the ITS will be similar. I cannot imagine a situation where it's materially faster or slower to 60mph and in the quarter.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/acur...cs-comparison/
https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...-quarter-mile/

[erickonphoenix]

I can't wait to see the ADM on this, even in SETX traditionally weak hot hatch market the CTR is routinely stickering for 55k US. Will the ITS be in the 60s?

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by erickonphoenix

I can't wait to see the ADM on this, even in SETX traditionally weak hot hatch market the CTR is routinely stickering for 55k US. Will the ITS be in the 60s?

I don't believe the ITS will rival the CTR with respect to ADMs. There will be far more of them available and demand won't outstrip supply. The ITS will also be manufactured in the United States so that takes the edge off some. There have also been reports of Acura dealerships already agreeing to MSRP on this car. 6+ months into the CTR production run MSRP is still a wet dream for nearly all prospective buyers. We'll see what happens.

[Ricochet48]

Honestly really excited for this! It's essentially a Civic Type R in a tuxedo. The exterior is also very much improved with the aggressive front & rear touches as well as the fender flares (seriously transforms the car imo). As an audiophile, I've also heard great things about the ELS system which even trumps the upgraded HK systems.

As a RSX-S owner, I was hyped for the initial Integra release, but very let down as the base model is essentially a Civic Si with a dash of Acura 'luxury'. I quickly turned my gaze to the M240i (love me that Thundernight!) With the Integra Type S announcement though, I've taking a much more serious look back at Acura (which I'm sure won't be popular here on a BMW forum haha).

I'm guessing the ITS will land around $49K, which is the starting price of the RWD M240i; however, I would be looking at a fairly loaded xDrive model at $57K - $59.5K (depending on the Cooling/Tire Pack), so essentially a nearly $10K difference which is sizeable.

There seems to be quite a bit of unique 'features' for each that would prevent a lot of cross shopping and I'm well aware. If you want an engaging 6MT, the Integra is only option (aside from the M2 in another class)... if you want AWD & much more power, the BMW is the clear winner... if you want practicality the rear seating and hatch dominate (many would look at the M340i though)... if you care about badges the BMW is the way.

The 650lb weight difference can be felt all the time, while you can rarely utilize the raw power of the B58 in a daily setting. The lighter weight also translates into cheaper consumables and such (I would feel more comfortable tracking the ITS, etc.). Reliability wise, I think the K20C1 also has a slight edge on the B58 (although time will tell).

For comparison, my RSX-S is meant to be driven 9/10 almost all the time, you rev up a lot to get usable power (with a laughable 140tq these days)... any of these options would be a HUGE upgrade performance wise. I feel the ITS would be much closer of an experience with a 6MT and FWD that I would ring out a bit more. The BMW would be much heavier, less engaging (although the ZF8 is great!), but have LOTS of power for the rare instances I can floor it, etc. Living in Chicago, I would also LOVE SH-AWD on the ITS, but it I've gotten around fine in the snow with FWD & winter tires.

Brain dump/rant over haha. Honestly curious on some of your thoughts, if you had $50K to spend on either a new ITS or used M240ix and each would fit your use case, what would your move be?

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by Ricochet48

Honestly really excited for this! It's essentially a Civic Type R in a tuxedo. The exterior is also very much improved with the aggressive front & rear touches as well as the fender flares (seriously transforms the car imo). As an audiophile, I've also heard great things about the ELS system which even trumps the upgraded HK systems.

As a RSX-S owner, I was hyped for the initial Integra release, but very let down as the base model is essentially a Civic Si with a dash of Acura 'luxury'. I quickly turned my gaze to the M240i (love me that Thundernight!) With the Integra Type S announcement though, I've taking a much more serious look back at Acura (which I'm sure won't be popular here on a BMW forum haha).

I'm guessing the ITS will land around $49K, which is the starting price of the RWD M240i; however, I would be looking at a fairly loaded xDrive model at $57K - $59.5K (depending on the Cooling/Tire Pack), so essentially a nearly $10K difference which is sizeable.

There seems to be quite a bit of unique 'features' for each that would prevent a lot of cross shopping and I'm well aware. If you want an engaging 6MT, the Integra is only option (aside from the M2 in another class)... if you want AWD & much more power, the BMW is the clear winner... if you want practicality the rear seating and hatch dominate (many would look at the M340i though)... if you care about badges the BMW is the way.

The 650lb weight difference can be felt all the time, while you can rarely utilize the raw power of the B58 in a daily setting. The lighter weight also translates into cheaper consumables and such (I would feel more comfortable tracking the ITS, etc.). Reliability wise, I think the K20C1 also has a slight edge on the B58 (although time will tell).

For comparison, my RSX-S is meant to be driven 9/10 almost all the time, you rev up a lot to get usable power (with a laughable 140tq these days)... any of these options would be a HUGE upgrade performance wise. I feel the ITS would be much closer of an experience with a 6MT and FWD that I would ring out a bit more. The BMW would be much heavier, less engaging (although the ZF8 is great!), but have LOTS of power for the rare instances I can floor it, etc. Living in Chicago, I would also LOVE SH-AWD on the ITS, but it I've gotten around fine in the snow with FWD & winter tires.

Brain dump/rant over haha. Honestly curious on some of your thoughts, if you had $50K to spend on either a new ITS or used M240ix and each would fit your use case, what would your move be?

I appreciate you sharing your perspective on this because it takes me a back a bit. I owned a 2005 RSX Type S years ago and really, really enjoyed that car. I lusted after it as a kid after bearing witness to the "Who Loves Ya, Baby?" campaign. I was over the moon when I was able to buy one just a few years later as the first car I ever bought. I researched everything about that car and had so much fun on ClubRSX. Fun Fact: When Acura brought the RSX Type S to market in 2002, they estimated the target buyer to be 27 years of age, with a college degree and $60,000 in average annual household income. They also estimated the buyer to be "affluent, lead active lifestyles, and are trendsetters." Not sure that's how it worked out as it seemed many of the buyers didn't tick those boxes. At that time in my life, I was none of those things.

Anyhow, I simply cannot get behind the Integra Type S. Like BMW, Acura lost its way long ago and all the nostalgic feelings in the world cannot get me to like this car. Nothing about it works for me. The interior, especially the seats, is awful, the paint color palette leaves a lot to be desired, and the bolted-on fender flares look tacky. These are 'L's IMHO and I could continue. Couple that with a sticker price likely north of $50K, and that's a lot of money vis-à-vis what you're getting. I really wanted to like this car, but this is a hard pass for me. In the interest of full disclosure, I own an FL5. It's not perfect but it's a masterful creation. The rave reviews from various publications, journalists, and YouTubers are warranted and legit. To use a sports reference: Honda knocked the cover off the ball with the FL5.

[Ricochet48]

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

I appreciate you sharing your perspective on this because it takes me a back a bit. I owned a 2005 RSX Type S years ago and really, really enjoyed that car. I lusted after it as a kid after bearing witness to the "Who Loves Ya, Baby?" campaign. I was over the moon when I was able to buy one just a few years later as the first car I ever bought. I researched everything about that car and had so much fun on ClubRSX. Fun Fact: When Acura brought the RSX Type S to market in 2002, they estimated the target buyer to be 27 years of age, with a college degree and $60,000 in average annual household income. They also estimated the buyer to be "affluent, lead active lifestyles, and are trendsetters." Not sure that's how it worked out as it seemed many of the buyers didn't tick those boxes. At that time in my life, I was none of those things.

Anyhow, I simply cannot get behind the Integra Type S. Like BMW, Acura lost its way long ago and all the nostalgic feelings in the world cannot get me to like this car. Nothing about it works for me. The interior, especially the seats, is awful, the paint color palette leaves a lot to be desired, and the bolted-on fender flares look tacky. These are 'L's IMHO and I could continue. Couple that with a sticker price likely north of $50K, and that's a lot of money vis-à-vis what you're getting. I really wanted to like this car, but this is a hard pass for me. In the interest of full disclosure, I own an FL5. It's not perfect but it's a masterful creation. The rave reviews from various publications, journalists, and YouTubers are warranted and legit. To use a sports reference: Honda knocked the cover off the ball with the FL5.

Mid 30s now, ClubRSX was a big deal to me back then. I was active over 20 years ago and learned a LOT. I picked my Type S up at a young age, but started to make their apparent target income right after college. Now I'm making more than double that income and wanting to upgrade to a more mature, higher performance ride.

Everything made sense in your second paragraph, until you noted you have an FL5 (which is an incredible track performer for the $). The Integra is literally an FL5 that's 95% of the track performance with more creature comforts & 'luxury' (the ELS sound system is huge to me) for $4-$5K more. I honestly could not rock the FL5's spoiler at my age and the bright red seats might be great for racing, but not my style for daily use tbh.

So at $4-$5K more, you're at about $49K. I had a major knee jerk reaction to that as the base RWD M240i is also $49K, but then I started speccing more similar builds. For instance building a 230i xDrive with all the standard ITS options (with a sunroof delete), landed at $48.8K. I also looked at the S3, the tier with the nice sound system starts at $53.5K, add comparable features and you're at $57K+ (same as a loaded M240i xDrive). The more practical Golf R is fully loaded at $46K, but looks super boring with a rough entertainment system (lack of physical buttons, etc.) Overall for $50K a very well spec'd ITS doesn't sound a rough when you dive into the competition.

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by Ricochet48

Mid 30s now, ClubRSX was a big deal to me back then. I was active over 20 years ago and learned a LOT. I picked my Type S up at a young age, but started to make their apparent target income right after college. Now I'm making more than double that income and wanting to upgrade to a more mature, higher performance ride.

Everything made sense in your second paragraph, until you noted you have an FL5 (which is an incredible track performer for the $). The Integra is literally an FL5 that's 95% of the track performance with more creature comforts & 'luxury' (the ELS sound system is huge to me) for $4-$5K more. I honestly could not rock the FL5's spoiler at my age and the bright red seats might be great for racing, but not my style for daily use tbh.

So at $4-$5K more, you're at about $49K. I had a major knee jerk reaction to that as the base RWD M240i is also $49K, but then I started speccing more similar builds. For instance building a 230i xDrive with all the standard ITS options (with a sunroof delete), landed at $48.8K. I also looked at the S3, the tier with the nice sound system starts at $53.5K, add comparable features and you're at $57K+ (same as a loaded M240i xDrive). The more practical Golf R is fully loaded at $46K, but looks super boring with a rough entertainment system (lack of physical buttons, etc.) Overall for $50K a very well spec'd ITS doesn't sound a rough when you dive into the competition.

I realize these cars can't be everything to all people at the same time. It's a wonderful thing that we have choices. I just personally don't see the ITS draw. In all fairness, I don't daily drive my CTR. It has less than 200 miles on it after nearly a month of ownership. Half of that mileage is driving it to ppf, Exoshield, and a friend's shop to get work done.

[Ricochet48]

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

I realize these cars can't be everything to all people at the same time. It's a wonderful thing that we have choices. I just personally don't see the ITS draw. In all fairness, I don't daily drive my CTR. It has less than 200 miles on it after nearly a month of ownership. Half of that mileage is driving it to ppf, Exoshield, and a friend's shop to get work done.

Oh I hear you on the lack of driving. I drive maybe 75 miles a month max living downtown. My 06 has less than 50K on it. The ITS would be a toy that I won't buy until I have a personal garage (currently my building is like $300 a month for public parking, but I go across the street for $200 which still sucks).

Curious on the ITS pricing, my guess is $48,475 for the record. Time will tell haha.

[Humdizzle]

i was an integra hater. but wow they knocked the looks out the park with type s.

i do think that the type s will hold value better than the 240i. that will help offset the relatively high entry price and probably sway me to pick the integra. yes, the bmw will be faster. But i think the integra will 'feel' better when you're flowing through the turns. 600-700 pound weight difference is huge.

[Donatello.]

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

I realize these cars can't be everything to all people at the same time. It's a wonderful thing that we have choices. I just personally don't see the ITS draw. In all fairness, I don't daily drive my CTR. It has less than 200 miles on it after nearly a month of ownership. Half of that mileage is driving it to ppf, Exoshield, and a friend's shop to get work done.

For $50k, you're nuts or rich to buy a ITS.

[Donatello.]

Originally Posted by Ricochet48

Oh I hear you on the lack of driving. I drive maybe 75 miles a month max living downtown. My 06 has less than 50K on it. The ITS would be a toy that I won't buy until I have a personal garage (currently my building is like $300 a month for public parking, but I go across the street for $200 which still sucks).

Curious on the ITS pricing, my guess is $48,475 for the record. Time will tell haha.

If it's a toy, why not get a sports car, muscle car or a convertible, etc? Makes no sense to have something like this as the "toy" IMO

[Ricochet48]

Originally Posted by Donatello.

For $50k, you're nuts or rich to buy a ITS.

I think it'll be $48.5K, but yup materially close.

The trick is comparing to the competition with similar features, as many others start relatively basic. If you want the top sound system (hugely important to me), upgraded seats/interior color, 19's, active suspension, etc. some of the European offerings get pricey quick (priced below). Of course none are offered in the engaging Honda 6MT either...

Civic Type R = $43.8K (too ricer, no trims, ADM insane)
Golf R = $45.8K (ugly, boring colors, already loaded)

Loaded 230i = $47.3K (sunroof delete)
Loaded S3 = $58.8K (lel, nearly a RS3)
Loaded AMG CLA 35 = $55.9K
Loaded M235ix = $53.2K (yikes!)
Loaded M240ix = $57.5K (w/o Cooling/Tire)
Loaded RC 350 F Sport AWD = $58K (nope.exe)

Only the M240ix on this list has the performance to warrant a $9K increase imo. You get MUCH more power and AWD, but in a heavier auto. With the $9K saved in the Integra you could put $2K to a Hondata flashpro and intercooler/pipes and be plenty fast for a daily.

With traffic in Chicago the number of times I can redline even my RSX-S with 140tq is limited... I just don't feel I'd use the M240i even near its potential aside from the occasional roadtrip or suburban visit. As noted, with the 650lb difference & Honda reliability/cheaper parts, I would feel comfortable tracking the ITS much more than the G42 too.

[heavyD^2]

The build quality of the FK8 Type R was crap and reliability not much better. That said Honda moved production of the FK9 Type R to Japan so I expect quality should be better. This Integra is being built in Ohio but I expect build quality to be better than the Swindon built FK8 Type R's.

[pikkagtr]

Originally Posted by Ricochet48

I think it'll be $48.5K, but yup materially close.

The trick is comparing to the competition with similar features, as many others start relatively basic. If you want the top sound system (hugely important to me), upgraded seats/interior color, 19's, active suspension, etc. some of the European offerings get pricey quick (priced below). Of course none are offered in the engaging Honda 6MT either...

Civic Type R = $43.8K (too ricer, no trims, ADM insane)
Golf R = $45.8K (ugly, boring colors, already loaded)

Loaded 230i = $47.3K (sunroof delete)
Loaded S3 = $58.8K (lel, nearly a RS3)
Loaded AMG CLA 35 = $55.9K
Loaded M235ix = $53.2K (yikes!)
Loaded M240ix = $57.5K (w/o Cooling/Tire)
Loaded RC 350 F Sport AWD = $58K (nope.exe)

Only the M240ix on this list has the performance to warrant a $9K increase imo. You get MUCH more power and AWD, but in a heavier auto. With the $9K saved in the Integra you could put $2K to a Hondata flashpro and intercooler/pipes and be plenty fast for a daily.

With traffic in Chicago the number of times I can redline even my RSX-S with 140tq is limited... I just don't feel I'd use the M240i even near its potential aside from the occasional roadtrip or suburban visit. As noted, with the 650lb difference & Honda reliability/cheaper parts, I would feel comfortable tracking the ITS much more than the G42 too.

57$k loaded premium A90 Zupra MT
<3300 lbs and the same silky smoove B58 the M240i has