Little help - water heater, insurance and some maths

[Alfisti]

So as of July our insurance will no longer cover damage from our 12 year old water heater as it is long in the tooth. Wondering if i should replace it?

It is located in my finished basement, damage would be a PITA but not especially expensive as the utility room is reasonably well drained. Still, a massive PITA to be sure.

Wondering if the savings in a more efficient system will go some way to offsetting the roughly $1,200 cost to buy and install? It costs about 11c per cubic metre here, whatever the fuck that means. We use about 150CM ($80) in warmer months but not sure what proportion of that is the water heater, maybe 20%? Anyone?

Also any knowledge of the efficiency gains of a new versus 12 year old unit? At even $20 month for gas, even if twice as efficient it's only a $10 month saving.

Thanks in advance.

[tracer bullet]

$1200 sounds expensive, but not sure the going rates in your area. in Minneapolis it'd be more like $800. It's not a bad DIY project but maybe best let a pro do it if you haven't done that kind of stuff before.

Your cubic meter cost is likely the cost of natural gas for you. $80 in gas in a warm month doesn't sound right, most houses would be closer to say $20, or a little more for a big family, but again that's US prices. Are you sure you're paying $80 in gas?

My (admittedly limited) experience is that water heaters either fail internally or develop slow leaks, but it may take you a while to notice it. 12 years is "getting up there" but not too bad. You are at the beginning of the range where they fail.

Unless you have a huge problem, you'll gain efficiency with a new heater but it won't be dramatic, it won't cut your costs in half. 10 - 20% might be more like it.

If it was mine I'd let it go a bit longer if it's not showing any signs of trouble. But about the time it got 15, 16 years old or the first indication of a problem it'd be gone.

One other thought is how long do you plan to keep your house? If you sell it at any time at all soon then it'll be a small selling point to say it's new.

[styler69]

buy a home warranty, if majority of your home appliances are 10yo or older then its cost effective. i use AHS and my warranty is 600/yr plus 75 for each claim. this year they covered a new dishwasher, furnace, new water heater and 2 repairs to clothes washer. furnace repair alone would have cost several thousand...

[lakefront]

Before you think about replacing the heater, pull the anode rod and see how much is left. There should be a hex fitting in the top of the heater, here its 1 1/16 inch I believe......anyway, thats the anode rod. A sacrificial element that can be replaced to extend the life of the tank itself. Just drain a gallon or 2 from the heater (close the valve on the inlet line ) and unscrew the anode. After 12 years its prolly long gone. Have a new one handy and either teflon tape or thread sealant on threads and the tank should last at least another 5 years. I've done this regularly on my in-laws heater and its 26 years old and doing fine.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by tracer bullet

$1200 sounds expensive, but not sure the going rates in your area. in Minneapolis it'd be more like $800.

Your cubic meter cost is likely the cost of natural gas for you. $80 in gas in a warm month doesn't sound right, most houses would be closer to say $20, or a little more for a big family, but again that's US prices. Are you sure you're paying $80 in gas?

$1200 all in is inline with what I have heard, that's purchase, install, taxes fees etc etc.. all in. I know you yanks like to talk before all the BS is applied

$80 is correct, may dip as low as $60 mid summer. Stove, washer and dryer are gas too.

[RickFLM4]

Personally, I'd just replace it since it is in a finished basement. When considering efficiency, I usually start with accepting a replacement is needed and then consider the cost / efficiency differential in a more efficient appliance vs. a less efficient appliance. In my experience I haven't found it makes sense financially to pay for top-of-the-line efficiency unless there are other benefits (e.g. longer warranty, quieter operation, etc.). Most of this comes from evaluating a/c units rather than water heaters because when I have needed to replace water heaters I haven't had the luxury of time to evaluate too many choices.

I haven't heard of an insurance company limiting coverage because of the age of a water heater but anything is possible with insurance companies. Did they lower your rate to reflect their reduced risk? (I'm guessing not.)

[Scout10]

ALL gas water heaters have an energy efficiency rating sticker (yellow)
located on them (maybe Canada also) write it down and go to a
HD or Lowes and compare.
A "high efficiency" gas model requires an electric circuit and an
insulated exhaust duct, added to replacement cost.
There is also the efficient on demand systems. No tanks to re-heat.
A thermal wrap blanket does help for tank types.

[dzvero]

keep the heater. you dont have to go to store , look online for the efficiency

[Joekerr]

Given that fricking Wynne is mouthing off about natural gas being bad for the environment and hydro far superior, gas rates may go up more than they already have.

So take that into consideration, though her reign of terror will be over shortly I hope. But the dumbasses in Ontario may very well vote in another liberal party which will likely be just as bad as she was and may continue her little pet projects. If so, you are looking at an increase in gas, which may make the savings a little more worthwhile.

Still, go to the energy stickers posted on the appliances in Lowe's / Home Depot and get some ideas of what the new ones drain. Based on your appliances, it may very well be fair to just divide your gas consumption equally among the four to get an idea of your current cost.

[Mike991M4]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

$1200 all in is inline with what I have heard, that's purchase, install, taxes fees etc etc.. all in. I know you yanks like to talk before all the BS is applied

$80 is correct, may dip as low as $60 mid summer. Stove, washer and dryer are gas too.

1200 CAD = 880 USD, so I think thats where the comparison is off. The home show I listen to on talk radio here on the weekends say the useful life of a water heater is 8 years, so 12 is pushing it. That being said, ours is 15 years old now. Its in the garage though, so no worries if it leaks, but it is due for a change out

[UncleWede]

How "hard" is your water? The harder the water, the shorter the lifespan on the tank/efficiency. The last 50gallon tank I took out only held 30 gallons because of the sediment on the bottom.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Mike991M4

1200 CAD = 880 USD, so I think thats where the comparison is off. The home show I listen to on talk radio here on the weekends say the useful life of a water heater is 8 years, so 12 is pushing it. That being said, ours is 15 years old now. Its in the garage though, so no worries if it leaks, but it is due for a change out

TBH exchange rate is irrelevant, the cost compared to median incomes is what counts and professional salaries here are in line with US salaries, as in before exchange. So it's expensive.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Given that fricking Wynne is mouthing off about natural gas being bad for the environment and hydro far superior, gas rates may go up more than they already have.

Her wage announcements today mean i am letting go of all of my hourly staff in Ontario, 300 jobs, gone.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Her wage announcements today mean i am letting go of all of my hourly staff in Ontario, 300 jobs, gone.

That really sucks. For them and for you. I just can't believe the arrogance of this government.

You won't be alone either - a lot of small corps are going to let people go I suspect and then people are going to realize the government hurt them rather than helped them. Or perhaps we'll see a lot of jobs go underground, but that is risky for the employer.

What hurts is that a lot of small corps see their employees as something like friends (to a degree), so it is going to hurt the employer to let these people go. Maybe the government is counting on this - that the pain will outweigh the pain of making less profit. Personally, I hope not, the government needs to be held accountable.

What business are you in by the way?